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Author Topic: Angst!
CMOT Dibbler
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Babbler # 4117

posted 31 January 2008 09:53 AM      Profile for CMOT Dibbler     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The development of the Internet has been both a blessing and a curse for people with disabilities. On the one hand, it has given us access to services that 15 years ago we didn't have access too,( online banking, Amazon etc.) but on the other, it's given people an excuse to not allow disabled people to have fulfilling social lives. Who needs a ramp to the local cafe when you can start a thread called "local cafe" on your favorite message board and discuss stuff whith your best( and extraordinarily anonymous) pals.
Talking on the web is like visiting a strip club. You can see things that interest you, but you can't actually touch the person your interacting with. It's ultimately a somewhat hollow and artificial expierence.
Instead of a system that facilitates actual socalization, we are stuck with a system that gives us the illusion of socialization while not solving the over all problem.
I shouldn't really complain. I do get out to lunch, concerts etc., and I suppose I do have a social network of the non virtual sort. It just pisses me off that you are all so far away and meeting wouldn't be possible, unless, of course, I were to move to Vancouver or Toronto, and that won't happen for a while yet.

[ 31 January 2008: Message edited by: CMOT Dibbler ]


From: Just outside Fernie, British Columbia | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
rural - Francesca
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 14858

posted 31 January 2008 10:02 AM      Profile for rural - Francesca   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Interesting.

On the rural urban divide we have found technology empowers us to participate as it reduces distance, but I also know the feeling of being the only one on the phone, while the rest are in person, and feeling rather 'small'.

I know most cities have accessibility requirements for buildings etc., it's very slow going and "January" doesn't help at all.

It's a good message to keep in mind, that technology can be isolating as well as enabling.

Oh and by the way, I'm not sure if you're allowed to touch at a strip club anyway!


From: the backyard | Registered: Dec 2007  |  IP: Logged
OMeNerves
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Babbler # 14751

posted 31 January 2008 10:40 AM      Profile for OMeNerves     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
talking on the web, is like visiting a strip club

... fascinating idea.

I was thinking that talking online was more the textual equivalent of streaking (exposing the self to unknown others).

On the topic of accessibility: it's ridiculous when people, groups, companies or whoever say that physical access can be ignored because of the magical internet. I can see how it would be 'a blessing and a curse.'


From: toronto | Registered: Nov 2007  |  IP: Logged
CMOT Dibbler
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4117

posted 31 January 2008 01:42 PM      Profile for CMOT Dibbler     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
I was thinking that talking online was more the textual equivalent of streaking (exposing the self to unknown others).

The cofee shop thing is a bit of an exageration, but I think some people DO have the idea that the net is just as good as or better than, reality.


From: Just outside Fernie, British Columbia | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
Boarsbreath
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posted 31 January 2008 03:19 PM      Profile for Boarsbreath   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The web a strip club! Both ways: like streaking, when you're the stripper; like peeping, when you're the watcher.

Only, for me it's basically a library, where I can read all the magazines for free, and when I should be working...


From: South Seas, ex Montreal | Registered: Jul 2005  |  IP: Logged
Accidental Altruist
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posted 01 February 2008 08:07 AM      Profile for Accidental Altruist   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
hmmm... not having ever beento strip club I guess I can't commment.
From: i'm directly under the sun ... ... right .. . . . ... now! | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
CMOT Dibbler
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Babbler # 4117

posted 01 February 2008 07:30 PM      Profile for CMOT Dibbler     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Accidental Altruist:
hmmm... not having ever beento strip club I guess I can't commment.

I haven't either. the analogy falls apart anyway because I think there are some strip clubs that allow you to touch. Internet communication really does lack substance though.


From: Just outside Fernie, British Columbia | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
martin dufresne
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posted 01 February 2008 10:07 PM      Profile for martin dufresne   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Not to take a contrarian position, I find it hard to imagine having debates half as intense as the ones that go on all the time here if I was with only one or two people in a noisy bar with constant interruptions, half-assed attempts at seduction, image-consciousness, or ingesting food, etc. etc.
Different expectations, different intensities.

"You can be smart as hell
Know how to add
Know how to figure things
On yellow pads
Answer so no one knows
What you just said
But when you're all alone
You and your head
What's the computer say, it's mumbling now
It says "hey Joe"
It's spelled it out and
"You've got angst in your pants"
"You've got angst in your pants"

But when you think you've made it disappear
You're sure you made it disappear
And you've still got angst in your pants."
Sparks (1982)

Sparks & Les Rita Mitsouko together: inoubliable

[ 01 February 2008: Message edited by: martin dufresne ]


From: "Words Matter" (Mackinnon) | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
CMOT Dibbler
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4117

posted 02 February 2008 10:38 AM      Profile for CMOT Dibbler     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Not to take a contrarian position, I find it hard to imagine having debates half as intense as the ones that go on all the time here if I was with only one or two people in a noisy bar with constant interruptions, half-assed attempts at seduction, image-consciousness, or ingesting food, etc. etc.
Different expectations, different intensities

Well I don't think bars are the best place for real world conversations. It would be easier to talk in kitchens and coffee shops,depending of course, on which kitchen
or coffee shop your going to talk in.

I still believe that seeing the person you're debating with in the flesh makes it easier to be civil.


From: Just outside Fernie, British Columbia | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
martin dufresne
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Babbler # 11463

posted 02 February 2008 10:40 AM      Profile for martin dufresne   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
For sure.
But we'd never be agreeing on it if it weren't for Babble!

From: "Words Matter" (Mackinnon) | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
CMOT Dibbler
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Babbler # 4117

posted 02 February 2008 12:46 PM      Profile for CMOT Dibbler     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I guess, but what comes after agreement? The internet has given me the ability to contact people, but it hasn't really given me the opportunity to actually get to know them. I've only gotten to see a small part of their over all personalities.
Yes, I know I wouldn't be able to see all of an idvidual's personality even if I did meet them in person, but it would probably be more interesting then sitting behind a sheet of virtual glass and seeing only text.

[ 02 February 2008: Message edited by: CMOT Dibbler ]

[ 02 February 2008: Message edited by: CMOT Dibbler ]


From: Just outside Fernie, British Columbia | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
CMOT Dibbler
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Babbler # 4117

posted 02 February 2008 01:10 PM      Profile for CMOT Dibbler     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
the road to revolution is not paved with binary code.
From: Just outside Fernie, British Columbia | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
martin dufresne
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posted 02 February 2008 01:17 PM      Profile for martin dufresne   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I have seen a lot of instances of people meeting in person after Internet chatting or a lengthy mail correspondence (this is how it went with my very first girlfriend - we wrote for 5 months before even meeting).
Indeed, Internet-then-meet seems to be the m.o. of contemporary find-a-partner-online systems - which I am not crazy about because men are such total assholes therein.
I also have met people with whom I had had only e-mail contact over political issues. Doesn't always work out well; I have often felt disappointed at such times and experienced the need to "repair" to a safer, more issues-based exchange, where one can choose words, consider responses, etc.
Yet, when asked recently by my sister to join her in an on-line ScrabulousTM game, I demurred, saying I preferred the thrill of face-to-face, body language, real-time gamesmanship with real wooden chips on the table.
So there are a lot of angles here, and certainly even more so for differently abled people.

From: "Words Matter" (Mackinnon) | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
CMOT Dibbler
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Babbler # 4117

posted 02 February 2008 01:40 PM      Profile for CMOT Dibbler     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I think it's mainly internet message boards that I'm taking issue with, and the idea that "the world is at your finger tips" if you have access to the net, which is clearly bullshit. the web is useful(especially E-mail) but it's a tool, nothing more. Human interaction should still be considered a cornerstone of a fulfilling existance.
From: Just outside Fernie, British Columbia | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
martin dufresne
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Babbler # 11463

posted 02 February 2008 03:55 PM      Profile for martin dufresne   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
"should"... but people are so... icky! (Just kidding...I hope)
Still I hear you when you say:
quote:
It just pisses me off that you are all so far away and meeting wouldn't be possible, unless, of course, I were to move to Vancouver or Toronto, and that won't happen for a while yet.

I write for a community newspaper whose staff I have yet to meet. The editor-in-chief lives one block away and we have exchanged numerous e-mails but never walked down a flight of stairs to have a coffee! Sometimes, I will e-mail my co-tenant rather than disturb her concentration when she is on-line ("Smell the bacon? There is a bagel for you too.")
But the newspaper has a get-together-over-dinner every three months when an issue comes out. I have missed the first two but will attend the third to meet my colleagues!! Babble could do the same sometime with Montrealists, Torontools, OwenSoundbytes and Vancouvermin all meeting on a given evening in their respective cities. (I'd love to meet Unionist and Lagatta.) Has this been tried before?

[ 02 February 2008: Message edited by: martin dufresne ]


From: "Words Matter" (Mackinnon) | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
CMOT Dibbler
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4117

posted 02 February 2008 04:49 PM      Profile for CMOT Dibbler     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Alright, let me put it another wayI want more social interaction. But even moving beyond my personal desires, getting people with disabilities (and people in general) out socalizing with their peers is important for the health of society. We live in cookie cutter homes in souless suburbs, eat terrible food, fear our neighbors, don't exercise etc. The first step to dealing with these issues is to get people talking to each other face to face.
From: Just outside Fernie, British Columbia | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
martin dufresne
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posted 02 February 2008 05:17 PM      Profile for martin dufresne   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
A sad step in the other direction - "Big Sister' on-line brothel Fascinating the way this story is almost entirely spun in terms of men's interests: the johns, the business owners/procurers, the voyeurs.

[ 02 February 2008: Message edited by: martin dufresne ]


From: "Words Matter" (Mackinnon) | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
bliter
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Babbler # 14536

posted 02 February 2008 06:06 PM      Profile for bliter   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Is the English language inadequate? Just curious.
Why "angst"? Seems sorta clinical jargon that a shrink might use in justifying his/her fee.

Aren't we talking about "anxiety"?

quote:
The band NOFX also has a song titled "All Outta Angst" which mocks the teenage need for angst and condemns those who use it as an excuse for their behaviour. Also see a band named angst.

Not only teens.


From: delta | Registered: Sep 2007  |  IP: Logged
CMOT Dibbler
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Babbler # 4117

posted 02 February 2008 06:47 PM      Profile for CMOT Dibbler     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Yes.
quote:
Has this been tried before?

[ 02 February 2008: Message edited by: CMOT Dibbler ]


From: Just outside Fernie, British Columbia | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
martin dufresne
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 11463

posted 02 February 2008 06:55 PM      Profile for martin dufresne   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Anxiety is to angst what a pebble underfoot is to "Am I expected to stand on those things?"
From: "Words Matter" (Mackinnon) | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
M. Spector
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posted 02 February 2008 07:01 PM      Profile for M. Spector   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Lachrymose is to dyspeptic as ebullient is to effervescent.
From: One millihelen: The amount of beauty required to launch one ship. | Registered: Feb 2005  |  IP: Logged
CMOT Dibbler
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4117

posted 02 February 2008 07:21 PM      Profile for CMOT Dibbler     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
good taste is to Jerry Springer what the truth is to Bill Clinton.
From: Just outside Fernie, British Columbia | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged

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