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Author Topic: Spears loses custody of 2 boys to Federline
Frisko
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posted 02 October 2007 03:48 PM      Profile for Frisko     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
On Tuesday, Spears's attorney Sorrell Trope, told People magazine that the judge granted the order after Spears failed to comply with two earlier conditions set by the court.

The judge had earlier ruled that she must show a valid California driver's licence and submit to random drug and alcohol tests.



This is sad,maybe she should sue the scum in hollywood.

http://www.cbc.ca/arts/media/story/2007/10/01/britney-custody.html?ref=rss

[ 02 October 2007: Message edited by: Frisko ]


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Briguy
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posted 03 October 2007 03:35 AM      Profile for Briguy     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Wow. Is this the definition of a no-win situation (for these children)?
From: No one is arguing that we should run the space program based on Physics 101. | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
bigcitygal
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posted 03 October 2007 03:43 AM      Profile for bigcitygal     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Sorry to be the "forum topic police" but this is SO not national news. I suggest this is moved to culture.
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Cueball
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posted 03 October 2007 03:50 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I feel pretty sorry for Britney. She really got fucked over. She was really young when she got into the business, and she is in fact still pretty young. She got fed into a system that gave her a very limited roll as a performer, and in fact, just in raw abilities was a pretty talented artist, technically -- that said, I hate her music.

So, basicly she got stuck in this box as pablum teen sex symbol, which I am sure had some appealing points, especially for a teenager ("Kewl, I get to dance with a live snake! On TV!"), but now she is typecast as this, and probably doesn't even really understand what is going on, and just hates it all -- problem is her image couldn't grow with her. Enter sleepless nights, drugs.

I thought is was brilliant when she chopped off her hair, really. She needed to rebel. But this is craziness according to some, and so they make her out to be an unfit mother -- "she chopped her hair" -- "Oh my god" -- "she is crazy".

No one said Sinead O'Connor was crazy.

Best thing for her would be is the labels just dropped her and got out of her life altogether. Problem is that is all she knows, and all her "friends" are in that scene. Its going to be a big crash.

Hope she has some friends somewhere. Hopefully, she can put the pieces together, later, and start again doing something she actually wants to do.

[ 03 October 2007: Message edited by: Cueball ]


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Alexandra Kitty
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posted 03 October 2007 08:58 AM      Profile for Alexandra Kitty   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Cueball:
No one said Sinead O'Connor was crazy.

I wouldn't go that far.

But there are a lot of differences between the two the most important being Sinead could sing and has talent.

Britney made it far on her distinctive jiggle.

But the other difference is Sinead burst out of the scene with her shaved head; so whether you thought that was her schtick or that was just the way she was, there was no shock.

Britney was introduced to the public as a watered-down Bettie Page -- looking wholesome, but with enough sex appeal to be seen as hip.

Then she turned out to be something different than the original presentation.

With Sinead we had nothing to compare her to -- so we saw that as her baseline and accepted it.

We had a baseline with Britney and what she has become is worse than what we first saw.

And, for the record, I don't think Britney shaved her head because she was crazy or was crying for help. With all that hair-coloring and over-use of hair extentions (plus she doesn't seem to me like she's an overly clean person), I'm sure there was all sorts of things festering in her scalp.


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Cueball
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posted 03 October 2007 09:23 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Actually Britney can also sing.
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ghoris
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posted 03 October 2007 09:26 AM      Profile for ghoris     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I feel the most sorry for those two boys in all this. If people feel sympathy for Britney Spears having her life and her young adulthood ruined by the Hollywood fame machine (and I don't entirely disagree), what about these two kids who are growing up in that environment? If either of these kids makes it to his 20s without some sort of substance abuse problem or criminal charge, I'll be shocked.

Funny how some people get ground up in the gears of the cult of celebrity machine but others manage to avoid it.


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Cueball
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posted 03 October 2007 09:27 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I am sure that Sinead stinks just as badly as Speares after a few days of missed showers on the road. Just what are we talking about here? Have you ever been on a tour bus?
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Alexandra Kitty
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posted 03 October 2007 10:17 AM      Profile for Alexandra Kitty   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Cueball:
I am sure that Sinead stinks just as badly as Speares after a few days of missed showers on the road. Just what are we talking about here? Have you ever been on a tour bus?

But Sinead's head is shaven to begin with. I was referring to lice festering in someone's hair. I'm not going to sniffing the arm pits of has-been singers to give you an update...


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Cueball
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posted 03 October 2007 12:55 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Yes, and this is precisely the kind of pidegeon holing I am talking about, Muck Jaeger, Dim Morescum, and Jinny Lysol can make a mint looking all beat to shit, while not changing their friggin leather pantaloons for months, and the media and the fans are gobbling it up, while they want Britney to be all Virgin Fresh and smelling sweet... well guess what, she aint.

[ 03 October 2007: Message edited by: Cueball ]


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Alexandra Kitty
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posted 03 October 2007 02:04 PM      Profile for Alexandra Kitty   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Cueball:
Yes, and this is precisely the kind of pidegeon holing I am talking about, Muck Jaeger, Dim Morescum, and Jinny Lysol can make a mint looking all beat to shit, while not changing their friggin leather pantaloons for months, and the media and the fans are gobbling it up, while they want Britney to be all Virgin Fresh and smelling sweet... well guess what, she aint.

[ 03 October 2007: Message edited by: Cueball ]


Not an equal comparison. None of those not-so-fresh dudes you list started as posing as naughty-but-nice choir boys. Mick Jagger in particular has always been very savvy at the image and marketing game. So is Madonna.

And there are female performers who are or were ribald, wild and in-your-face and they had an audience.

Britney's problems have to do with a whole bunch of apolitical problems. The most important one being she does not have a good pubicist who can sweep her numerous messes under the rug or market her bad girl antics as being part and parcel of being an artiste.

Tom Cruise had Pat Kingsley and he could do no wrong. he sacked her and then suddenly started to look like a freak. He didn't change, but his optics committee did.

Gender has very little to do with it. She's difficult to manage, erratic, and worst of all, does not seem like she understands she's got a big image problem. She cuts out people who don't praise her; so there's no feedback.

I think after this album is released, she should really get completely out of the spotlight for a couple of years and straighten out her mess like a responsible adult, then go back and put out something strong.


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minkepants
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posted 03 October 2007 05:07 PM      Profile for minkepants     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Hit Me Baby One More Time

I'm A Slave For You

Just what the fuck was being marketed to 9 year old girls here?


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Cueball
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posted 03 October 2007 05:16 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
S&M Sex.

quote:
Originally posted by Alexandra Kitty:

Not an equal comparison. None of those not-so-fresh dudes you list started as posing as naughty-but-nice choir boys. Mick Jagger in particular has always been very savvy at the image and marketing game. So is Madonna.

And there are female performers who are or were ribald, wild and in-your-face and they had an audience.

Britney's problems have to do with a whole bunch of apolitical problems. The most important one being she does not have a good pubicist who can sweep her numerous messes under the rug or market her bad girl antics as being part and parcel of being an artiste.

Tom Cruise had Pat Kingsley and he could do no wrong. he sacked her and then suddenly started to look like a freak. He didn't change, but his optics committee did.

Gender has very little to do with it. She's difficult to manage, erratic, and worst of all, does not seem like she understands she's got a big image problem. She cuts out people who don't praise her; so there's no feedback.

I think after this album is released, she should really get completely out of the spotlight for a couple of years and straighten out her mess like a responsible adult, then go back and put out something strong.


We agree on a lot of this, except the parts about her being shoved into a very specific marketing pardigm, that very few women ever manage to escape in the business.

The number of raunchy hell bent for leather chicks who make it in the industry is far below that of males. And no Madonna did not start out that way, she was pretty mimsy, and the only thing that really distinguishes her from the Britney's motif, is that it is clear that Madonna was smart enough to be in on the joke.

Madonna was 22 or something when she signed her deal with Sire, and she really didn't break out from the pop-tart mode until she hit 30. You are comparing the marketing empire built by a 30 something year old woman with a 15 year old fed into the label system.

The only female performer I can think of who comes close to being the kind of low down and skanky looking rock chick of the Ramones/Stones/Doors type, is Patti Smith, but these others evenr Sinead, was still clean, as you yourself pointed out.

[ 04 October 2007: Message edited by: Cueball ]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Stargazer
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posted 03 October 2007 05:21 PM      Profile for Stargazer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Britney is a product. One created by her family and promoted by the music industry. She could not have possibly had the time, nor the motivation, to lead a normal life. Her downfall is no surprise to me because she is a human being with apparently very low self esteem and an even lower ability to make decisions on her own. She had her kids way too young, with a man who used her, and she was clearly unable to be the mother people expected her to be. I think it is disgusting that people in the gossip industry were looking forward to her downfall, and her children being taken away to be raised by a man who left his pregnant girlfriend for Britney.

Her whole MTV appearance was the final nail in her musical career. MTV needed a freak factor, and Britney was it. She was paid to perform hoping that she would fail. She was put on the show for the whole world to watch her demise. After being slammed consistently by the media she gave them what they expected - a horrible performance. If you watch the video you see a woman with no confidence. Someone who is appearing in front of all of these people she looks up to who she knows have been judging her by the gossip and her screw-ups, and not much else. She was doomed to fail and I think that MTV knew that and used her for ratings.

She's being adequately punished now - no kids, dropped by her managers and PR people, soon to be dropped by her label. People are hoping she'll attempt suicide so they can sell more magazines. This is the environment she is in, and unfortunately she is not as strong as Paris Hilton is and cannot seem to stand up to the constant criticism.

I feel sorry for her and her kids. No one really knows what is going on in her head and I for one refuse to condemn her based upon bullshit gossip rags. I don't know her but I know that I would hate to be judged and condemned as she has been.


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Cueball
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posted 03 October 2007 05:31 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Yeah that is a pretty good summary of what they did to her on MTV. Kanye West spoke up for her. Begining to have a lot more respect for that guy.
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Stargazer
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posted 03 October 2007 05:34 PM      Profile for Stargazer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Yeah I was impressed by that too. He caught on to the Britney as freak aspect as well and refused to play along.
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ghoris
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posted 03 October 2007 07:28 PM      Profile for ghoris     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Kanye West may be a huge egomaniac, but he's proven himself to be a pretty perceptive, no-bullshit guy.

Remember this?


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Cueball
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posted 03 October 2007 09:35 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Even more impressive, in my view was articulating a position against homophobia... well ok it has its flaws, but speaking out against the GWB is clearly going to sell with much of his traditional market, but anti-homophobia was much less likely too, given how macho the hip-hop scene is:

quote:
"I'm still trying to get over my own homophobia. I still wouldn't feel comfortable at a gay bar. I wouldn't go to a gay parade. I don't know if I'm in favor of gay marriage or not. People said to me, 'Were you scared of speaking out against George Bush?' No. The bravest thing I did this year was speaking out against homophobia. That's a scarier topic, because if you bring it up, people think you must be gay. But you don't have to be gay to not gay-bash. We're a very close-minded people."


Kanye West Revisits Homophobia


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Cueball
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posted 03 October 2007 10:04 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
This links to the intereview: Kanye West in the MTV awards and Britney Spears

[ 03 October 2007: Message edited by: Cueball ]


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Bacchus
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posted 03 October 2007 11:24 PM      Profile for Bacchus     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
She's difficult to manage, erratic, and worst of all, does not seem like she understands she's got a big image problem.

Sounds like Sinead, who was often referred to as crazy by the media, starting with her pope pic on SNL and then her ordination as a heretic catholic priest.


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Cueball
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posted 04 October 2007 12:14 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The difference is she was never viciously attacked as "crazy" for going against stereotype, like Spears has been attacked, for cutting her hair. Sinead was attacked as eccentric and provocative, for making statements attacking the Catholic orthodoxy, or other causes she took on. The context was political not image based.

Thing is this whole perception of Britney Spears, much of it built around factual events in her life, were hyped to such an extent that completely irrelevant and normal things, such as shaving her head, were backfilled into the "psychological assessment" as added evidence of her craziness, when in reality there is nothing particularly crazy about someone, even women ( ) shearing their head.

Britney’s bald head: Cry for help? -- Pop star may be saying she’s feeling ‘damaged and sick,’ expert says: MSNBC

quote:
Spears, 25, shocked the owner of Esther’s Haircutting Studio in Los Angeles on Friday night by grabbing shears and shaving her own head. Esther Tognozzi said she refused to help Spears, telling reporters she feared being sued if she were to help the clearly troubled singer ruin her public image.

It's not prima facie evidence of craziness. It was made into prima facie evidence because Britney could no longer be the Britney everyone expected her to be.


What is this? It's not crazy -- This is punk. She didn't like it so she shaved it off.

[ 04 October 2007: Message edited by: Cueball ]


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Stargazer
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posted 04 October 2007 05:28 AM      Profile for Stargazer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Thing is this whole perception of Britney Spears, much of it built around factual events in her life, were hyped to such an extent that completely irrelevant and normal things, such as shaving her head, were backfilled into the "psychological assessment" as added evidence of her craziness, when in reality there is nothing particularly crazy about someone, even women ( ) shearing their head.

Exactly, and websites such as PerezHilton.com have been doing the damage to Britney far before she shaved her head. If you want a real look at a person who seems to want to force Britney to kill herself, have a gander at this misogynistic asshole's gossip page. He gets rewarded for calling women whores, berating women for having the audacity to age, berating woman for being "shanky hos" and outing gay males, with his own talk show. He is known for drawing penises on people's faces. I kid you not. Now he has videos on YouTube publically calling for Britney to kill herself.


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babblerwannabe
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posted 04 October 2007 08:53 AM      Profile for babblerwannabe     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Cueball:
S&M Sex.

We agree on a lot of this, except the parts about her being shoved into a very specific marketing pardigm, that very few women ever manage to escape in the business.

The number of raunchy hell bent for leather chicks who make it in the industry is far below that of males. And no Madonna did not start out that way, she was pretty mimsy, and the only thing that really distinguishes her from the Britney's motif, is that it is clear that Madonna was smart enough to be in on the joke.

Madonna was 22 or something when she signed her deal with Sire, and she really didn't break out from the pop-tart mode until she hit 30. You are comparing the marketing empire built by a 30 something year old woman with a 15 year old fed into the label system.

The only female performer I can think of who comes close to being the kind of low down and skanky looking rock chick of the Ramones/Stones/Doors type, is Patti Smith, but these others evenr Sinead, was still clean, as you yourself pointed out.

[ 04 October 2007: Message edited by: Cueball ]


Wrong. Madonna has been breaking out from the "pop tart" model ever sine she rolled around singing "like a virgin" in her wedding dress on MTV. Madonna was also wearing large crosses around her neck while professing to feel like a virgin, I think she has always been trying to push the envelope ever since she sang her first hit. She was never just a pop tart. She also posed nude BEFORE she even had her first hit (when she was about 19) and then Playboys found her nude pics and released them to hurt or "embarrass' Madonna in the mid 80s, Madonna just shrugged it off and use that advertisement to further her own popularity.

[ 04 October 2007: Message edited by: babblerwannabe ]


From: toronto | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 04 October 2007 12:25 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Well you can read Madonna how you like. I personally did not find anything that provocative about "like a Virgin." Flirting with virginal stereotypes is par for the course in mainstream female pop iconogrpahy. She doesn't really do anything offensive until the fourth album in 1989 where she fucks black Jesus.

So she is then 31.


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babblerwannabe
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posted 04 October 2007 06:46 PM      Profile for babblerwannabe     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Cueball:
Well you can read Madonna how you like. I personally did not find anything that provocative about "like a Virgin." Flirting with virginal stereotypes is par for the course in mainstream female pop iconogrpahy. She doesn't really do anything offensive until the fourth album in 1989 where she fucks black Jesus.

So she is then 31.


Fair enough, but it's not just how I read it.

Madonna did encounter a public controversey in 1985. Maybe she didn't start it, but I think she has always been unafraid of controversey. Wearing a large cross while wearing provcative clothings and singing about virginity were not exactly family friendly back in the early 80s.

quote:
Penthouse and Playboy magazines published a number of black and white nude photos of Madonna taken in the late 1970s. The publications caused public controversy. Madonna at first tried to block them from being published, but later remained unapologetic and defiant Speaking to a global audience at the outdoor Live Aid charity concert at the height of the controversy, Madonna made a critical reference to the media and stated she would not take her jacket off, despite the heat, because "they might hold it against me ten years from now".[17] Madonna later appeared on the cover of the NY Post newspaper, quoted as saying about the photographs "I'm NOT ashamed."


Madonna on Wikipedia

Madonna was 27 in 1985.

[ 04 October 2007: Message edited by: babblerwannabe ]


From: toronto | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 04 October 2007 07:02 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
And I disagree, the Maddona Whore thing is as old Margaret Lawrence. Nothing special.

Yes and it will confirm that "like a Prayer" came out in 1989 on her fourth album when she was 31.

[ 04 October 2007: Message edited by: Cueball ]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
anchovy breather
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posted 04 October 2007 07:11 PM      Profile for anchovy breather     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
2 years after Margaret Laurence left this mortal coil.

/nitpick
//thread drift
///buttinsky


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I AM WOMAN
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posted 07 October 2007 08:01 PM      Profile for I AM WOMAN     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Cueball:
She doesn't really do anything offensive until the fourth album in 1989 where she fucks black Jesus.

I don't recall this. When did this happen ?


From: tall building | Registered: Oct 2007  |  IP: Logged
jas
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posted 07 October 2007 08:31 PM      Profile for jas     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Well, Britney's shaving her head may have been merely "irrelevant and normal", as Cueball suggests, as it might be for anybody, famous or obscure. But I can't help but think that for someone whose payroll and star power resides so much in that stagnant, fixated, pretty/sexy/naughty image that the star machine required of her, to suddenly chop all that off with a pair of hair scissors is not merely irrelevant. It was a - possibly momentary - but real, as well as symbolic, f***-you to that machine.

When I first heard of it, I thought "well, maybe she's going sane."


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Cueball
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posted 07 October 2007 08:35 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Yeah. I thought it was great.

quote:
Originally posted by I AM WOMAN:

I don't recall this. When did this happen ?


In the song "like a prayer." Ok the sexual liason to black Jesus is only heavily implied.


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged

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