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Author Topic: My Meidel is the Centerfold
audra trower williams
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posted 09 April 2003 12:35 PM      Profile for audra trower williams   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
As the self-proclaimed first-ever synagogue-attending Jewish centerfold, Lindsey finds herself heralding a new generation of young Jewish women seeking appreciation for their bodies as well as their minds. Already busy with school, car-dealership appearances, and magazine signings, Lindsey has also had to schedule time to defend her bunnyhood to the Jewish community, which has had a mixed reception to her naked debut. On a panel organized by Makor, a Jewish cultural center on Manhattan’s Upper West Side, she went head-to-head with Shmuley Boteach, the young Hassidic rabbi famed for his book Kosher Sex as well as for his post in Michael Jackson’s clutch of spiritual advisors.

the rest.


From: And I'm a look you in the eye for every bar of the chorus | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Mycroft_
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posted 09 April 2003 12:45 PM      Profile for Mycroft_     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I always thought Hasidic porn would be close up shots of naked ankles.
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Michelle
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posted 09 April 2003 12:48 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Hey, I've heard of this woman before! I seem to remember reading about her quite a while back (not on rabble - maybe in my women's studies course? hmm).
From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
audra trower williams
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posted 09 April 2003 01:08 PM      Profile for audra trower williams   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
she's pretty. I'd like to have a word with her makeup artist, though.
From: And I'm a look you in the eye for every bar of the chorus | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Mr. Magoo
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posted 09 April 2003 01:22 PM      Profile for Mr. Magoo   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I seem to recall that Playboy also had a disabled centerfold once. Err, I mean I recall hearing about it. Paraplegic, in case you're curious.
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Michelle
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posted 09 April 2003 01:39 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
We understand, Mr. Magoo. You only read it for the articles. (Kidding!)

This article is awesome! Although it's weird, I guess I live a sheltered life or something, because a some of those stereotypes they mention are ones I've never heard before.

I'm conflicted on the issue though, as conflicted as I was when the "fat fashion magazines" were out. One one hand, it can be positive for a group not normally thought of as beautiful to be portrayed as sexy and beautiful. But on the other hand...sigh. It's like, "congratulations, fat/Jewish/black chick, now you too can be as objectified as skinny blonde white chicks."

I mean, Playboy isn't exactly that last bastion of feminist activism, you know?

I guess overall if it makes her feel good about herself and it shoots down an ethnic stereotype, then my attitude is, why not.


From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
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posted 09 April 2003 01:49 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
BTW, do I want to know what "Kosher Sex" is?
From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Mycroft_
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posted 09 April 2003 02:07 PM      Profile for Mycroft_     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I think there's an article on it in the braille edition of Playboy.
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Mr. Magoo
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posted 09 April 2003 02:20 PM      Profile for Mr. Magoo   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
BTW, do I want to know what "Kosher Sex" is?

I'm guessing No Porking and No Shrimping, but Matzhoh-balling is OK.


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Michelle
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posted 09 April 2003 02:23 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Mycroft - hahahahaha!

Yeah, I found it ironic that the guy plugged (?) the book in Playboy.


From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Mycroft_
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posted 09 April 2003 02:34 PM      Profile for Mycroft_     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The rumour about "kosher sex" is that it involves a sheet with a hole in it. In fact, though, my understanding is that Orthodox rabbis insist that sex be very sensual and pleasurable for both parties. Cunnilingus is considered part of the menu of options, for instance, so for all its reputation "kosher sex" is much more liberal than acceptable sex for religious Christians.
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Michelle
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posted 09 April 2003 02:39 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Yes, I did notice that they touched on that a bit in the article. I just got a kick out of the title - without any backgrounder on the subject matter, it IS a bit of an eye-grabber.

Weird that Christians would have such a traditional phobia about pleasurable sex, and in particular, pleasure for women, when neither the Islamic or Jewish traditions seem to be that way.

Although if you read books by Christian sex therapists, you'll generally find pretty liberal ideas about what goes on in the marital bed, I think. I don't know too many Christians who would think, for instance, that oral sex between a husband and wife is sinful. Not saying that there aren't Christians out there who believe that it's sinful, but I doubt it's very mainstream.


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lagatta
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posted 09 April 2003 03:21 PM      Profile for lagatta     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
But isn't it illegal in Virginia?

If you do a Google on kosher sex you will find a huge array of sites and articles on the topic. I think a lot of secular or less observant people of any religious background find the lives of the very orthodox fascinating, little as many of us would want to belong to such a tightly-controlled community. Where I live it would be mostly Hassidic Jews in Mile End / Outremont, or very observant Muslims. Perhaps in parts of rural Ontario or elsewhere it would be Old Order Mennonites.

Editing to add a joke (sorry, couldn't resist):

Kosher Sex

A couple preparing for a religious conversion meets with the orthodox rabbi for their final session. The rabbi asks if they have any final questions.

The man asks, "Is it true that men and women don't dance together?"

"Yes," says the rabbi, "for modesty reasons, men and women dance separately."


"So I can't dance with my own wife?"

"No."

"Well, okay," says the man, "but what about sex?"

"Fine," says the rabbi. "A mitzvah within the marriage!"

"What about different positions?" the man asks.

"No problem," says the rabbi.

"Woman on top?" the man asks.

"Why not?" replies the rabbi.

"How about doggie-style?"

"Of course!"

"Well, what about standing up?"

"NO!" says the rabbi, "It could lead to dancing!"

[ 09 April 2003: Message edited by: lagatta ]


From: Se non ora, quando? | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
Mycroft_
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posted 09 April 2003 03:54 PM      Profile for Mycroft_     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I had a friend in high school who was an Orthodox Jew. Met him again a year or so ago and run into him from time to time since then (turns out he lives in my building). He now makes a living running a sex/porn website! ( I don't think he's Orthodox anymore... he doesn't wear a kippa in any case... I asked him if at least his, um, models were Orthodox and he briefly discussed what an Orthodox site might be like (bald women, men with long beards, lots of ankle shots) before saying no, it's a "regular" site.

Seems he got the idea from the CBC a few years ago when he saw an item on how much money you could make from running an internet porn site.


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Michelle
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posted 09 April 2003 03:58 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Hee, lagatta, reminds me of one of my old standard Baptist jokes:

Why can't Baptists drink? It might lead to dancing!

Mycroft, that's pretty wild. Although I think I'd be pretty shocked if any of my old acquaintences, religious or not, made it big with internet porn!


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lagatta
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posted 09 April 2003 04:05 PM      Profile for lagatta     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
A Moroccan Muslim friend (non-observant) tells a similar joke about Muslim fundamentalists, or at least observant Muslims.

A husband comes home to find his wife in bed with another man. He exclaims: "whew, am I relieved! Rumour had it that you were out on the street corner, smoking a cigarette!"


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Mr. Magoo
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posted 09 April 2003 04:20 PM      Profile for Mr. Magoo   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Hehe.

A young Irish woman ventures off to London to seek her fortune, and writes back to her family to say that she's found work as a secretary.

Years pass, and she learns that her aging father is in poor health, so she comes back home to visit him. When she arrives, it's in grand style: fancy car, fancy clothes, jewelry, etc. Her ill father remarks that being a secretary in London must pay well!

Unable to lie, she tells her father, "I tried being a secretary, but it paid poorly, and I couldn't afford to live well, nor send money home to you and mother, and so I became a prostitute."

Her father, already ill, fell to the ground clutching his chest and was carried in to his bed.

The family expected the worst, and the daughter, fearing she'd never have another chance, went to speak to her father.

"Father," she said, "I'm so sorry. I never wanted to make you or mother ashamed... I only wanted to be able to repay your kindness, and give you some of the finer things in life. If I could have done that as a secretary, I would never have become a prostitute."

At this her father jumped up, bounded out of bed and hugged her. "Oh my dear daughter!", he cried, "my ears must be going ... I thought you said Protestant!"


From: `,_,`,_,,_,, | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
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posted 09 April 2003 04:27 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
All right, total thread drift, but I can't resist.

A Baptist minister was passing a group of young teens sitting on the Church lawn and stopped to ask what they were doing.

"Nothing much, Pastor," replied one boy. "We were just seeing who can tell the biggest lie about their sex life."

"Boys, boys, boys!" he scolded. "I'm shocked. When I was your age, I never even thought about sex."

In unison they all replied, "You win!"


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TommyPaineatWork
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posted 10 April 2003 02:20 AM      Profile for TommyPaineatWork     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
I mean, Playboy isn't exactly that last bastion of feminist activism, you know?

Certainly not, but the Playboy I remember, I guess from the 70's, was one of the leading liberal voices in American magazines. It was pro-choice and, if I remember correctly, promoted things like equal pay and such.

What Hef's actual labour practices were, though are unknown to me.

Last I heard, he gave over his empire to his daughter from his first marriage, and she took it from near bankruptcy to a profitable organization again. But, my info is a bit old. Things may have changed.

One could say without contradiction from me that the pictorial Playboy objectified women. But the text Playboy, it seems to me, always portrayed sex as something that had to be enjoyed by both men and women.

I guess because Playboy had the biggest profile and circulation it became a lightning rod for some feminists, but it always seemed to me that Larry Flint and Bob Guicionne were more worthy targets.

quote:
It's like, "congratulations, fat/Jewish/black chick, now you too can be as objectified as skinny blonde white chicks."

Yeah, I don't know what to make of it either. Maybe at one time posing nude for a magazine was a revolt against societal control of women's sexuality, but today it's generally seen as quite the opposite. And, it's not like Playboy was ever a like a southern golf club, either, where there was a symbolic barrier broken.

As far as shattering stereotypes of Jewish American women... I never took such things seriously in the first place.


[ 10 April 2003: Message edited by: TommyPaineatWork ]

[ 10 April 2003: Message edited by: TommyPaineatWork ]


From: London | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
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posted 10 April 2003 09:27 AM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
But Jewish American women might take them seriously since they're the ones who have to live with the stereotypes.

quote:
Certainly not, but the Playboy I remember, I guess from the 70's, was one of the leading liberal voices in American magazines. It was pro-choice and, if I remember correctly, promoted things like equal pay and such.

I do believe you're right, although I was a bit young to be perusing the mags at that point. I "found" a collection from the 70's and early 80's at an age where I was a bit young to appreciate the political slant of the articles, but even the racy sections seemed to have very liberal attitudes not only to sex, but to society in general. That's why when a guy tells me, "I read it ALSO for the articles," I tend to believe him (I just don't when he says he reads it ONLY for the articles ).

I don't know. I could see it as a pretty neat form of political outreach, I guess - draw'em in with nekkid grils, and then you've got a captive audience for your liberal politics.

Now too bad we can't do the same for women. I subscribed before Christmas to a cooking magazine, and oh man, talk about Kinder, Kuche, Kirche. I'd love to see one of those magazines, which even attract women like me with home cookin' recipes, get a little more subversive, you know?


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Rebecca West
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posted 10 April 2003 03:50 PM      Profile for Rebecca West     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I'll take Playboy over Maxim any day. Where the former seems to genuinely enjoy women (in, albeit, a decidedly non-feminist way), the latter has nothing but objectifying contempt and scorn for the female gender.

The stereotyping of Jewish women goes hand-in-hand with the stereotyping of women in general and the anti-semetic stereotyping of Jewish people as a whole. It's bigotry, with no basis in fact.


From: London , Ontario - homogeneous maximus | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
TommyPaineatWork
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posted 10 April 2003 09:23 PM      Profile for TommyPaineatWork     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I was thinking back, remembering what sticks out in my mind from my adolescent years when I read "Playboy".

I can't remember one pictorial, not one photo. I do seem to remember that the secondary photo layout was more often than not a lot more interesting than the "centerfold" layout, but I can't remember any specifics.

I remember a "Playboy Interview" with Erich Von Daniken, where the interviewer asked all the hard questions, and opened my eyes to skepticism. I remember the Aurthur Hailey interview, too, about "Roots".

And, there used to be excerpts from newly released books. Gore Vidal's "Kalki" sticks out in my mind, as does one of Arthur C. Clarke's books.

I've leafed through copies of Maxim I've found laying around at work. If that's supposed to reflect the intelect of the common guy, then it's the best argument for having a sex change that I've ever seen.


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Mycroft_
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posted 10 April 2003 11:15 PM      Profile for Mycroft_     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
All the geeks would get their kicks from National Geographic pictorals
From: Toronto | Registered: Feb 2002  |  IP: Logged

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