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Author Topic: Judicial Activism Challenged
josh
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posted 12 December 2002 09:55 AM      Profile for josh     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
http://makeashorterlink.com/?F2CC32EB2

As someone who believes that the democratic process should be given as much leeway as possible, I applaud the court for raising the question.


From: the twilight zone between the U.S. and Canada | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
Marc
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posted 12 December 2002 01:33 PM      Profile for Marc     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I personally am a fan of judicial activism or at least how it has happened in the past. Important, controversial decisions, like Morgentaler, would never have been made if left to the hands of the legislatures. Gay rights, womens rights and abortion rights were and often still are "too controversial" for elected officials to handle. If judges like Bora Laskin, who had the guts to speak the truth, were constrained we would be even more neanderthal than we are now.

However, if some crazy conservative activist judge was to be appointed I probably would change my opinion about judicial activism pretty quickly.


From: Calgary, AB | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
josh
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posted 12 December 2002 03:13 PM      Profile for josh     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Ah, there's the rub, as they say. What's good for the goose is good for the gander.
From: the twilight zone between the U.S. and Canada | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
beibhnn
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posted 12 December 2002 05:32 PM      Profile for beibhnn     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
For anyone who's interested: The Newfoundland Court of Appeal decision and the B.C. Court of Appeal decision.

For the record, there are less spelling mistakes in the B.C. decision. I choose to believe that makes it superior. I suspect the SCC will find it to be the better decision though because it doesn't challenge the route they've been leading us on for the past 15 years.


From: in exile | Registered: Oct 2002  |  IP: Logged
jeff house
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posted 12 December 2002 08:22 PM      Profile for jeff house     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I think the Newfoundland Court is a bunch of reactionary scumbags.

Obviously, they are simply issuing a political opinion rather than a legal opinion, since the law is already clear. They tell the Supreme Court to alter the Oakes test. They do not wish to follow the Oakes test. They do not wish to follow the oakes test because, in this case, it results in women being paid full value for their work.

The idea that this kind of systemic discrimination can be dealt with by the "democratic system" is a fantasy. The women plaintiffs would go to their MP's till hell froze over, and would not get their due.

It is impossible to have a localized issue like this, relevant to only a small amount of women workers, to effect elections. Other issues are always most important to most people.

quote:
The Newfoundland ruling concludes that the province was amply justified in deciding that the equity payments were too costly to sustain.

Yes, equality is so costly. We should do away with it, and bring back patriarchy.

That is what the decision is about.

[ December 12, 2002: Message edited by: jeff house ]


From: toronto | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Tommy_Paine
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posted 12 December 2002 08:30 PM      Profile for Tommy_Paine     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Don't mind my hyperbolic blather, but it seems to me that some judges and others in authority are rather cowardly, clinging to 19th century views they like, under the protection of law that proscribes other quaint 19th century practices, like inviting block heads like that out for a little "grass before breakfast."
From: The Alley, Behind Montgomery's Tavern | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
'lance
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posted 12 December 2002 08:32 PM      Profile for 'lance     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
You've lost me, Tommy. Are you tying this in to the pot thread?
From: that enchanted place on the top of the Forest | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
josh
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posted 13 December 2002 09:33 AM      Profile for josh     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Disunity among the Justices on the question:

http://makeashorterlink.com/?M6D2212C2


From: the twilight zone between the U.S. and Canada | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
jeff house
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posted 16 December 2002 03:30 PM      Profile for jeff house     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
So now two of the three judges say they do not accept the commentary in the decision that the Supreme Court was wrong in setting out its Oakes test.

(That test is the fundamental decision in Constitutional law in this country, as it governs when the Charter can be used, and when not.)

Those who spend time in courts may well recognise the syndrome wherein one judge writes a lengthy opinion, and the other two simply write: "I agree".

Basically, they spend little time consiudering the arguments, and so leave it up to their colleague to decide, and then do not even read the decision he wrote.


From: toronto | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
josh
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posted 16 December 2002 03:51 PM      Profile for josh     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
One would hope that they read it before signing on to it.

In regular course, the opinion is circulated for comments. It is difficult for me to believe that in a case as important as this, neither of the other two judges bothered to read the opinion. I have a hunch that something else might have been going on, such as a desire to get the issue of the extent of "judicial activism" out in the open.


From: the twilight zone between the U.S. and Canada | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
josh
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posted 17 December 2002 09:47 AM      Profile for josh     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
One take on the controversy:

http://makeashorterlink.com/?O55713CC2


From: the twilight zone between the U.S. and Canada | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
beibhnn
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posted 17 December 2002 12:42 PM      Profile for beibhnn     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Hee. I didn't know anyone referred to the man on the Clapham omnibus anymore except for my very English mother.

Since that man is now likely a trendy pub attending yuppie who would care little about Lord Denning, the Newfoundland Court of Appeal or the Oakes test, I think Jeffry Simpson gives him too much credit when he says he would be confused about two judges now saying they're not altogether sure about that judgment they just signed off on. I think the man on the Clapham omnibus just wouldn't care.


From: in exile | Registered: Oct 2002  |  IP: Logged
jeff house
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posted 17 December 2002 01:13 PM      Profile for jeff house     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Jeffry Simpson's take on the issue seems reasonable to me.

Speaking of "common sense" and the Clapham omnibus, Lord Denning used that test to reject claims by IRA terrorists that the police had manufactured the evidence against them.

18 years later, in the case of the "Birmingham Eight", it was proven that the police, had, in fact, conspired to convict the defendants based on nonexistent proof.

Lord Denning, and the man on the bus, were wrong.


From: toronto | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged

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