Author
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Topic: Canadian Progressives and the Far Right
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Mc'lovin
recent-rabble-rouser
Babbler # 15706
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posted 08 November 2008 11:08 AM
Both have a hard time thinking of anything good to say about Canada, Obama.Both love to defend religion(selectively of course) Both judge people by their skin appearance Both insult and consider anyone with an opposing view - not just different, not even just unacceptable but an enemy Both have B & W, Good vs Evil, with us or against us, all or nothing view on many if not all issues Both love to use generalizations, an stereotypes, and tend to believe in secret conspiracies to explain event which contradict their world view. Just putting out what I see - I still would rather hang with the left side more but am often disappointed with the above.
From: canada | Registered: Nov 2008
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unionist
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 11323
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posted 08 November 2008 11:31 AM
quote: Originally posted by Mc'lovin: Just putting out what I see -
Ummm, professional firefighter? quote: I still would rather hang with the left side ...
They'll have to catch us first.
From: Vote QS! | Registered: Dec 2005
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genstrike
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 15179
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posted 08 November 2008 11:39 AM
quote: Originally posted by Mc'lovin: Both have a hard time thinking of anything good to say about Canada
And what exactly makes Canada so good? I don't like the government, and apart from that it is not much different than any other country. What exactly do you want me to say? quote: Originally posted by Mc'lovin: Obama
When you find something that an anti-capitalist might find good about Obama, let me know. quote: Originally posted by Mc'lovin: Both love to defend religion(selectively of course)
What? I don't love to defend religion, I am an atheist, I consider it the opiate of the masses, but I don't like it when people stir up hate against people just because of their religion, especially when they use it to justify imperialist wars and attacks on civil liberties. quote: Originally posted by Mc'lovin: Both judge people by their skin appearance
What? quote: Originally posted by Mc'lovin: Both insult and consider anyone with an opposing view - not just different, not even just unacceptable but an enemy
Everyone does this to some extent, and to some extent it is true in some arenas. I don't see how the left is any better or worse in this than anyone else, including the center quote: Originally posted by Mc'lovin: Both have B & W, Good vs Evil, with us or against us, all or nothing view on many if not all issues
Again, I don't see how the left is any different from the right or the center on this. quote: Originally posted by Mc'lovin: Both love to use generalizations, an stereotypes, and tend to believe in secret conspiracies to explain event which contradict their world view.
If you are referring to 9/11 conspiracies, in my experience only a small section of the left believe in those, and everyone else on the left can't stand it when they keep bringing them up. The rest of the radical left generally doesn't believe in conspiracies, but believes that there is a system (capitalism) at play here which does explain things, not just a few greedy people and assholes in secret rooms.
From: winnipeg | Registered: May 2008
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Mc'lovin
recent-rabble-rouser
Babbler # 15706
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posted 08 November 2008 12:06 PM
Genstrike - yr responses for the most part prove my point - why not be different or better than the rightwing? question everything - especially yr own beliefs Shallow understanding from people of good will is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Martin Luther King, Jr. [ 08 November 2008: Message edited by: Mc'lovin ]
From: canada | Registered: Nov 2008
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genstrike
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 15179
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posted 08 November 2008 12:17 PM
quote: Originally posted by Mc'lovin: Genstrike - yr responses for the most part prove my point - why not be different or better than the rightwing? question everything - especially yr own beliefs Shallow understanding from people of good will is more frustrating than absolute misunderstanding from people of ill will. Martin Luther King, Jr. [ 08 November 2008: Message edited by: Mc'lovin ]
Because politics is naturally a nasty business, especially when you are trying to get across a viewpoint that contains such things as class struggle and anti-capitalism. How do I be "better than the right wing" in your eyes? Start praising political opponents instead of questioning them? Preface any criticism with Stephen Harper with a compliment to how good he looks in a sweater-vest? And don't think I don't question things just because I am on the radical left. I do question things, and whenever I do, my beliefs make sense. That is why I believe them. I find a lot of people on the center are the ones who don't question things, they just take the intellectually lazy way out and say "you're both wrong. The truth is always in the middle."
From: winnipeg | Registered: May 2008
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Mc'lovin
recent-rabble-rouser
Babbler # 15706
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posted 08 November 2008 12:18 PM
FMOver course we did nothing to deserve our good fortune. Must a man gouge out his eyes to empathize with the blind? Is the idea to raise up people or bring others down? of course from a materialist point of view, this gets confusing in terms of needs and desires. What does a person need(anywhere on the planet) to feel satisfied? good luck answering that without judging or generalizing.
From: canada | Registered: Nov 2008
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Frustrated Mess
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 8312
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posted 08 November 2008 12:34 PM
quote: Originally posted by Mc'lovin: FMOver course we did nothing to deserve our good fortune. Must a man gouge out his eyes to empathize with the blind? Is the idea to raise up people or bring others down? of course from a materialist point of view, this gets confusing in terms of needs and desires. What does a person need(anywhere on the planet) to feel satisfied? good luck answering that without judging or generalizing.
Does the blind need our empathy? Yes, it does get confusing from a materialist point of view. So here is a question for you to generalize on: If to raise the growing global population to our standard of material living we will require four more planet earths, where do we get them from? [ 08 November 2008: Message edited by: Frustrated Mess ]
From: doom without the gloom | Registered: Feb 2005
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genstrike
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 15179
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posted 08 November 2008 12:37 PM
quote: Originally posted by Mc'lovin: genstrike Why think so small? Stephen Harper's sweater?
All right, please explain to me what exactly disappoints you with me criticizing people like Stephen Harper. Do you want me to make sure I preface every criticism with praise? quote: Originally posted by Mc'lovin: I was thinking more along the lines the cultural, social and political nature of people all around the world. Starting with looking at everyone on a equal plain. I realize this is difficult
Are you accusing myself and the left of racism? Or is it that we don't ignore the class differences which are central to society which is frustrating you?
From: winnipeg | Registered: May 2008
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Mc'lovin
recent-rabble-rouser
Babbler # 15706
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posted 08 November 2008 01:05 PM
genstrikeOf course Harper should be critized from the point of view that he is not some noble prince or the second coming of satan but a politician elected in our system as the party leader with the majority of seats at this time. It's actually quite simple. FM that's exactly my point - perhaps I wasn't clear I dream of a day where no one on earth goes to bed hungry - but the big question is - is western growth and decadence the result of too much choice or natural human greed. Christmas is coming and most people I know don't really "need' anything but just about everyone wants something or wants to give something - does this make them bad people and are the really that different from anyone else or do they just have a choice. So do you think we should take away choices?
From: canada | Registered: Nov 2008
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Frustrated Mess
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 8312
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posted 08 November 2008 02:37 PM
quote: Originally posted by Mc'lovin: I disappointed with yr response frankly.No I don't "enjoy" being a cog but I like to eat. Do I enjoy my lifestlye? I'm very far from rich or even middle class for that matter but sure I enjoy it. I'm sure I could enjoy a much more modest or meager lifestyle as well, but yr smug assumption that I'm not ready to sacrifice anything turned me off at this point. BTW how do you get an internet connection to yr log cabin at walden pond? let find the time to set me straight - what with growing yr own food and sewing yr own clothes. Jerk
What is that sets you off exactly? I explained my circumstances when I said, "I live in this world of plenty that affords me the luxury to ponder such questions." But you see, you're the one who says we must raise up all people while acknowledging the material considerations. So, I asked you a very legitimate question How do you go about rising the living standards of a growing global population to our own when that would require four earths? Clearly, for your idea, we need three more planet earths. From whence do they come?
From: doom without the gloom | Registered: Feb 2005
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