Author
|
Topic: Michaelle Jean as Governor General
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
lagatta
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 2534
|
posted 03 August 2005 08:16 PM
I know the Governor-General! We studied together; she is several years younger than me ( I was a "mature student", with a lot of experience working in trade-union and social movements) quote: Jean studied at the University of Montreal and universities in Florence, Milan and Perugia, Italy.
She sure speaks a tonne of languages: Creole, Italian, Spanish and no doubt others as well as French and English. But true, she is another "Radio-Canadienne" and a "cultural" one at that, coming from the arts, studying Italian language and literature and comp lit.
From: Se non ora, quando? | Registered: Apr 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
Reality. Bites.
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6718
|
posted 03 August 2005 08:17 PM
How embarassing! I just assumed Shane mispelled her first name since I'd never seen that spellng before, so I couldn't find any information on her at first.Her husband is documentary filmmaker Jean-Daniel Lafond. Seems like Martin went for a similar type to the Clarkson/Saul combo. She seems quite young for GG - about 48 or 49. Fluent in five languages - French, English, Spanish, Italian and Haitian Creole. Sounds like a great choice.
From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
lagatta
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 2534
|
posted 03 August 2005 08:20 PM
Yes, and beautiful, model-slim Michaelle (hint of envy) looks younger than her age. She is no bimbo though; she is extremely bright and cultivated. Actually, she is a bit older than I thought; I always thought she was about 10 years younger than I am, and she is no more than 4 or 5. Michaelle, and not Michelle, is her name. Wonder if she can have any impact on fairer relations with Haiti? [ 03 August 2005: Message edited by: lagatta ]
From: Se non ora, quando? | Registered: Apr 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
sgm
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 5468
|
posted 03 August 2005 09:04 PM
The points raised by lagatta and kingblake regarding Canadian policy in Haiti were the first that popped into my head when I read about this appointment.I'm just guessing, but I expect the Liberal government will spin her appointment as further evidence of the 'close ties' between Canada and Haiti, also manifest in our 'assistance' to that country. Meanwhile, the Liberal government will go on supporting, without asking too many serious questions, an interim government carrying on an unfortunate tradition of political imprisonments and other, more serious abuses. I don't mean to knock Jean personally. From what I've seen of her, she's an intelligent and engaging presenter who could make a good GG. I haven't seen her 1995 documentary on Haiti, 'Haiti dans tous nos rêves,'--have any other babblers?
From: I have welcomed the dawn from the fields of Saskatchewan | Registered: Apr 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
lagatta
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 2534
|
posted 03 August 2005 09:32 PM
Yes, of course I've seen 'Haiti dans tous nos rêves,' and spoken to Michaelle - and her mum - about the making of it. The last time I saw Michaelle was during the Radio-Canada strike (English CBC staff in Québec and Moncton were also on strike, as were the Northern Service people based in Québec, broadcasting in Aboriginal languages). If she hasn't turned tail, Michaelle was very progressive. However she will have to be the "Queen's rep" for Canadians/Québécois of all stripes. As much as possible, she should continue Adrienne Clarkson's keen interest in the arts - and no doubt tone down the spending - and a concern for development issues, in Haiti and elsewhere. I really don't know how much input she can have on Canadian policy in Haiti. She sure isn't a boring old white military man. Although technically middle-aged, Michaelle seems much younger, and not just because of her model's physique.
From: Se non ora, quando? | Registered: Apr 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
A longsuffering conservative
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 9425
|
posted 03 August 2005 10:18 PM
What a refreshing choice!She might have made an excellent prime minister! Too bad Martin didn't offer her HIS job instead. Now that would have been a formula for several Liberal majority governments...
From: The Sovereignist Dark Side | Registered: May 2005
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Boom Boom
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 7791
|
posted 03 August 2005 11:28 PM
Originally posted by RealityBites: 'bout time we had a gay GG, but I can't really see Mercer in the role, and I don't think he speaks a lick of French.The laughing smiley faces should have been a clue... edited to add: I'd love to see Mercer as G-G, but he's so committed to comedy I have difficulty imagining him in a serious role. Maybe he could do it. He doesn't speak French? [ 03 August 2005: Message edited by: Boom Boom ]
From: Make the rich pay! | Registered: Dec 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
r-tist
recent-rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6663
|
posted 04 August 2005 02:21 AM
Jean called 'inspired choice' for governor general quote: "It's obviously a very exciting appointment. Here's someone who's quite young, very dynamic, has a rapport with a lot of younger audience," said Paul Benoit, of the Monarchist League of Canada.At just 48 years old, the award winning journalist will become one of the youngest governors general ever, the third woman in the job and the first black person to call Rideau Hall home.
I think she's a great choice. Adrienne Clarkson did a great job promoting Canadian arts here and internationally, and I'm happy to see another GG from the creative community. She's got some great documentary credentials, and some nice awards: - Amnesty International Journalism Award in 1995
- 1994 Anik Prize for information reporting
- 2000 Galaxi Award for best information program host
I don't think she'll be able (if she's so inclined - I don't know) to focus attention on the political problems of Haiti, since she will now be in a job representing the Queen and Canada. I don't see her making a point of Canada's involvement in the coup last year. Maybe just the fact that she's from there will get a few people interested in the history of that country. Anyway, I really like her as the choice for our next GG, and I like her even more now that I know what that 'other site' thinks about her
From: Toronto | Registered: Aug 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
Paul Gross
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 3576
|
posted 04 August 2005 02:55 AM
quote: Originally posted by r-tist:
Now if she was also a same-sex-marriaged lesbian with an adopted child from a different racial background...
Ms. Jean's husband is Jean-Daniel Lafond. They have a six-year-old adopted daughter.
Source:Globe and Mail:
From: central Centretown in central Canada | Registered: Jan 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
siren
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 7470
|
posted 04 August 2005 04:38 AM
Well, I'm not shirley, but I agree -- the "adopted" comment is improper. It is an anachronism that casts doubt on the mother, the child and, in this new era, the father. When Marie-eden matures and reads copy from the era of her mother's appointment, she will surely feel -- what? Something less than included or welcomed.Other than the way some press are reporting . . . this is an interesting and welcome choice on many levels. I don't know anything about the new GG's husband -- I hope they can maintain the expected neutrality. As for P. Martin perhaps using Ms. Jean's history to avoid criticism of our complicity for the coup in Haiti? I would very much welcome an airing of this hugely problematic military deployment. It is very important and I would like some public discussion of this at the very least. But if a Haitian born woman was selected as GG, and accepted -- what are the chances she does/ does not agree with our military interference? If she does not disagree -- is there the very slightest possibility that assisting France and America in the coup was legitimate? How and Why? Ah, once again, I wish I was working as a self paid millionaire journalist, answerable to no one.
From: Of course we could have world peace! But where would be the profit in that? | Registered: Nov 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
maestro
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 7842
|
posted 04 August 2005 05:25 AM
I have to say I don't worry too much who the GG is given it is more or less a ceremonial post.Having said that, they could have done a lot worse than pick Michaelle Jean. I don't have a monarchist bone in my body, but... Yay, Michaelle! Jeez, are they going to start calling the GG's vessel Michaelle's Navy?
From: Vancouver | Registered: Jan 2005
| IP: Logged
|
|
Geneva
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 3808
|
posted 04 August 2005 06:14 AM
re CBC and GGs: Adrienne Clarkson and Ms Jean, yes, but before that Jeanne Sauvé had been a Radio-Canada broadcaster, too: http://www.gg.ca/governor_general/history/bios/sauve_e.aspMme Sauvé ... for over 20 years had a distinguished career as a journalist with the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation. She was elected as a Liberal member of Parliament for Ahunstic (Montréal) in 1972 ... [ 04 August 2005: Message edited by: Geneva ]
From: um, well | Registered: Feb 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
Geneva
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 3808
|
posted 04 August 2005 07:05 AM
I dunno, wouldn't Broadbent follow in the steps of GG (zzzzz) Schreyer? waste of time for these political guys, I thinkthe job is basically Official Greeter for Canada (WANTED: High-profile symbolic entity, discreet, for extensive handshaking, no heavy lifting, must mumble banalities to foreign worthies. Large house, $200,000 plus chef plus embossed stationery. Replies, P.Martin, PO Box 1234, Ottawa.) Little progress to have all these CBC women dominating post for the last 25 years (after it was the National Grandfather, with Roland Michener et cie. for so long) When will we see multiple female Ministers of Finance ? That is something, this nothing, basically. [ 04 August 2005: Message edited by: Geneva ]
From: um, well | Registered: Feb 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
Reality. Bites.
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6718
|
posted 04 August 2005 07:21 AM
quote: Originally posted by leftcoastguy: I wonder what kind of impact Ms Jean's appointment will have on the Quebec population, if any.
Oh it will definitely increase. quote: Originally posted by Aric H: I just looked at FD and the people there are furious with the choice.
I can't imagine a better indication that Martin made the right choice. [ 04 August 2005: Message edited by: RealityBites ]
From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
skdadl
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 478
|
posted 04 August 2005 08:18 AM
This looks like a superb choice to me. Given an enforced holiday from TV for several years, I'm sorry to say that I'd never seen or heard of Michaelle Jean before, but her bio strikes me as better than just impressive -- it is interesting, wonderfully off-centre. I'm hoping that the CBC will run some of those docs that she and/or her husband have made, especially the series that won her the Amnesty award. What an opportunity to open minds, eh? I can hardly wait. I am actually a believer in the office of the GG, in such a place structurally, although I want to see it continue to evolve. I also think that Clarkson helped the process along considerably, although she is undeniably affected by a certain kind of elitism more common to arts people of her generation than, I hope, the next one. She could do hauteur long before she became GG. And M. Lafond sounds to me a great improvement on M. Saul. Well, we'll see. Re Haiti: if Jean's mere presence in the office makes more Canadians at least curious about the subject, that would be an advance. Here's hoping. Oh. And congratulations to Michaelle Jean.
From: gone | Registered: May 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
eldeno
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 8549
|
posted 04 August 2005 08:58 AM
quote: Originally posted by lagatta:
Wonder if she can have any impact on fairer relations with Haiti?
Not unless Martin wants to park his boats in Haiti from now on. This is entirely visual. Michaëlle is almost as hard to spell as Machiavellian appointment of a foriegn aristocrat. Aren't you guys worried that something so visual will imply that the Canadian government has accomplished its diversity goals, despite that this office doesn't hold any power and that this won't affect the composition in Ottawa or any policies? How much heat is there going to be on Martin to appoint an ethnically diverse cabinet? [ 04 August 2005: Message edited by: eldeno ]
From: The L.B.C. | Registered: Mar 2005
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
Hinterland
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4014
|
posted 04 August 2005 10:07 AM
The wingnuts heads are indeed exploding. Just check around the usual wingnut haunts and this choice of GG (...a position they complain constantly of having no real meaning) seems to strike a lot of them as the 7th Sign of the Apocalypse.Honestly, these people need lives (and plenty of Xanax). But then again, they've got to keep their bile flowing since the homos are fading from the horizon.
From: Québec/Ontario | Registered: Apr 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
|
fern hill
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 3582
|
posted 04 August 2005 10:18 AM
quote: Originally posted by Hinterland: The wingnuts heads are indeed exploding.
Teehee. 'Tis true. All I know about Ms Jean I learned in the last hour, but I approve entirely of anyone who could get the Freaks' knickers so twisted. Let us count the ways: journalist? CBC journalist? female? person of colour? foreign born? Too much fun. Off to watch heads explode. . . .
From: away | Registered: Jan 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
quelar
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 2739
|
posted 04 August 2005 11:40 AM
On Michaelle, congratulations Paul, you actually made a decision that didn't end up with you looking like a donkey. My first thought on this was "Wow, give it another 20 years and Stromobolopolous has a good shot at it" - someone else beat me to this one though. On the adoption issue, it's ok to say it's an adoption because the Parents made it public knowledge, so there's no issue there.
From: In Dig Nation | Registered: Jun 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
V. Jara
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 9193
|
posted 04 August 2005 12:14 PM
A very promising choice. It's obviously very exciting to have someone as multicultural as Michaelle representing Canada. My disdain meter for the royal Governor General's office has officially dropped a notch. I have an idea for Michaelle's first big splash as gg. Take up the cause of Zahra Kazemi (the Canadian journalist murdered in Iran). It fits with some of the documentary work she's done and wouldn't it be a great head turner for Iranians when an articulate, attractive, black, Canadian, professional woman advocates for the human rights of a murdered female journalist. Allez-y Michaelle!
From: - | Registered: May 2005
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
Reality. Bites.
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6718
|
posted 04 August 2005 12:45 PM
quote: Originally posted by fern hill: I approve entirely of anyone who could get the Freaks' knickers so twisted. Let us count the ways: journalist? CBC journalist? female? person of colour? foreign born?
Oh please, please, please, let her announce that before she married her husband she was in a lengthy polyamourous relationship with a Muslim woman and a French pacifist. Regarding the adoption issue, considering it was an international adoption (perhaps of an older child?) and she was in the public eye at the time, it may well be common knowledge that received a lot of coverage at the time. I doubt it was a matter of anyone prying.
From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
kingblake
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 3453
|
posted 04 August 2005 12:58 PM
Here's her acceptance speech. Sorry it's so long. quote: Ladies, Gentlemen and Dear Colleagues,I would never have believed that fate had such an honour in store for me. I am moved and honoured by this show of confidence: the Prime Minister recommended me to be the 27th Governor General of Canada, and the Queen has agreed. This is a great honour to which I gave a great deal of thought. I asked myself: how and what could a Canadian and Quebecker like me who is conscious of her rights and responsibilities as a citizen contribute to the history, present and future of this vast country of ours. This country … with its immense and unlimited possibilities … rich with the daily contributions of people who have come from all over the world… I am part of this … My father and mother, like many other exiles, found Canada to be a refuge full of promise for their two children and a chance to rebuild their lives. By anchoring ourselves in Quebec, we were able to immerse ourselves in the French language we hold so dear. In the past, we spoke of solitudes in Canada among our founding peoples. Today’s Canada has more voices than before – each calling out to be heard, to be respected and to be understood. The diversity of our landscape, people and cultural backgrounds gives us a sense of community in Canada. I want individuals in Canada to be more than just told that they are included. They have to know and experience what Canada means to them and be able to participate in all this country has to offer. The greatest asset of this country is that it evolves. During the years I have worked as a journalist and a broadcaster on our public television channels, I saw prejudices fade and attitudes change. The days when someone would dare to think and say that a black person wouldn’t have any credibility as a journalist in the eyes of the public have passed. We must continue to grow. It is in this spirit that I have accepted this offer and that I will fulfill the role of Governor General. I will represent the Crown in Canada and perform all the constitutional and ceremonial duties that are part of our parliamentary democracy. But also important to me is making this institution one that reflects the voices of Canadians. For I believe this office has to connect with everyone in the country, without distinction. I want this office to continue to have life to it and connect with people from all walks of life, all backgrounds and circumstances. In other words, with all Canadians. I will, with conviction and enthusiasm, encourage citizens to gather together and to be engaged in their communities. I will honour what they accomplish. All this inspires me because hope is nourished by our ability to dream. The efforts of those citizens struggling to be heard – at home as well as abroad – have driven my journalistic and intellectual interests and passions. I have devoted a major part of my life to interviewing and listening to others. In taking the time to really understand their concerns and their drive to act, to contribute, and to give of themselves for the betterment of humanity. Years of involvement in social issues and in journalism have deepened my conviction and my appreciation for the increasingly complex reality of our world. I sincerely hope as Governor General to make humanity more human. I will act according to my convictions, always remaining true to myself, sustained by all that life has taught me. I have come a long way. My ancestors were slaves. I was born in Haiti, the poorest country in our hemisphere. I am a daughter of exiles driven from their native land by a dictatorial regime. I am a mother who worries about the kind of future that awaits her child and all the children on this earth. I care deeply about the founding values that unite us – values that we must defend, build on, and preserve. The most important value, in my eyes, is respect. The Canada I love is the one that defines itself through its respect for others, and through its recognition of each person’s integrity and dignity. For all these reasons, I am ready to put my shoulder to the wheel. I hope that, as Governor General, I will remind all Canadians of the ideals that we must pursue. It will be a journey that will take me across this country, a country that I have explored, but not yet fully. There is so much for me to discover, as I reach out to the men and women throughout this great land. It is indeed an honour to succeed Madame Adrienne Clarkson. Madame Clarkson has devoted an enormous amount of energy and devotion to her country and fellow Canadians through this office, ably supported by her husband, John Ralston Saul. Together, they have infused the office with a new energy: think of all the forums they have organized to foster the exchange of ideas, and of the zeal with which they promote artists and their achievements from across Canada. Equally significant has been their close work with Aboriginal communities. We will remember Adrienne Clarkson’s exceptional contribution to the public service and to Canada, not only as Governor General, but all through her career, including her work as a journalist. I am sure that all Canadians will join me in expressing our deepest gratitude. This is all so exciting! And I am so lucky – especially when I think of my husband Jean-Daniel and our daughter Marie-Eden. They are both as excited as I am, and are equally determined to join me in this great journey. I am a woman of action, and I can’t wait to get started. Thank you.
From: In Regina, the land of Exotica | Registered: Dec 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
dramaman
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 5586
|
posted 04 August 2005 02:44 PM
I agree, superb choice -And if you want to see dissenting opinions, go to FD, and read the almost 90 posts - ....one poor guy is actually saying that maybe she ain't such a bad choice, but he won't be around long....
From: SW Ontario | Registered: Apr 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
obscurantist
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 8238
|
posted 04 August 2005 02:59 PM
There's only one criticism I might make of Martin's choice, and it's probably a weak one.Arguably, if there was any time in recent history when a former politician would be the best pick for GG, it would be now, when there's a tenuous minority government and a good chance of another minority government after the next election. Someone with experience of minority government conditions, or at least of Parliament and elections, would have less learning on the job to do than someone without that experience. Clarkson didn't have any such experience, but at least she had four years on the job and one election campaign before she had to deal with a minority situation. On the other hand, maybe the GG's role in deciding when to call an election, and who to call upon to form government, is now so formal that prior political experience has no impact on one's ability to do the job. If the position is one well-suited to distinguished and articulate Canadians from all walks of life, then I agree that Martin has chosen well.
From: an unweeded garden | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
jeff house
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 518
|
posted 04 August 2005 03:32 PM
The choice of this GG looks pretty good to me.I see that lagatta knows Micaella! Well, that's pretty good street cred. However, I once met Romeo LeBlanc. This must be similarly impressive, I hope. ------ I still do worry about the non-greeter powers of the GG. Canada had the King/Byng affair, and Australia had Gough Whitlam's majority government ousted at the say-so of the GG of the time. So, good luck to the new GG. Let's hope she isn't too sorely tested by the challenges minority Parliaments may bring her.
From: toronto | Registered: May 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
VanLuke
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 7039
|
posted 04 August 2005 04:21 PM
I'm so impressed by all the famous people some babblers met!As a taxi driver during the October crisis I once drove a Que cabinet minister from Dorval to a secret meeting in the house of another minister. I had harangued him during the whole drive about politics and argued with him not knowing who he was. When we got to the destination I had 2 guns pointed at me, one from each side of the cab. The guys wore civilian clothes and it was not apparent at all that they were cops. I only put 1 and 1 together when I read about the 'secret meeting' the next day. I guess that doesn't count. It's always been my dream to be among celebrities. So back to the Celebrity Show. Forgive the thread drift. P.S. Oh wait! I once worked as a waiter at a luncheon where the guest of honour was PET. Am I part of the crowd now? He didn't invite me to his house though. edited to correct a spelling error [ 04 August 2005: Message edited by: VanLuke ]
From: Vancouver BC | Registered: Oct 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
Reality. Bites.
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6718
|
posted 04 August 2005 04:22 PM
quote: Originally posted by Boom Boom: Personally, I get the impression that the Dark Side is full of racist nuts.
Well not completely full. The overwhelming majority are truly deplorable excuses for human beings. I'm proud to say that no babblers are under police investigation for hate speech. There's an old saying that "If Shakespeare were alive today he'd be working on television." Well if Ernst Zundel were in Canada today, he'd be more than welcome to post on FreeDominion.
From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
Boom Boom
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 7791
|
posted 04 August 2005 04:42 PM
Originally posted by VanLuke: I'm so impressed by all the famous people some babblers met! I've been in conversation with two former Archbishops of Canterbury (Donald Coggan and Robert Runcie), the present Anglican Primate of Ireland (Robin Eames), and I listened to Archbishop Desmond Tutu as part of a cathedral congregation.
In our home during the 1950's and 1960's I met all the Directorates of History of the Canadian Forces. My dad was a well known military writer and worked with military cartographer Courtney C. J. Bond who was also known in Ottawa quite well, as one of the big supporters of the Ottawa Little Theatre, and as an author of books on Ottawa and area. Court Bond was a notorious practical joker and I was his victim a few times. My mother knew Paul Anka's family and I met Anka before he became famous - both of us very young at the time. [ 04 August 2005: Message edited by: Boom Boom ]
From: Make the rich pay! | Registered: Dec 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
r-tist
recent-rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6663
|
posted 04 August 2005 05:18 PM
quote: Originally posted by kingblake: Here's her acceptance speech. Sorry it's so long.
Thanks for posting that, kingblake. What a wonderful speech! Here's the link to it: Statement by the Governor General Designate
From: Toronto | Registered: Aug 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
VanLuke
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 7039
|
posted 04 August 2005 05:45 PM
quote: Originally posted by skdadl: [QB]VanLuke: I must say, your brush with fame sounds a lot more exciting than anything that has ever happened to me.
And I haven't even googled the names of fellow students at the LSE. (Btw PET went there too but as I said, I was 'just' one of the waiters.) There's got to be a few "statesmen" among them. I could have mentionned the beers Pierre Marc Johnson (or was it his brother?) bought for me and my companion after parliamentary hearings. edited to add: And let me tell you, looking into the ugly black holes of the 2 guns pointed at my head were only exciting in the sense that my heart rate went up tremendously. I had no idea if these guys were from the FLQ but I didn't think of the cops until the customer identified himself. When I told the cops that they had shook me up, they laughed heartily. [ 04 August 2005: Message edited by: VanLuke ]
From: Vancouver BC | Registered: Oct 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Aric H
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 5815
|
posted 04 August 2005 06:16 PM
quote: Originally posted by Wilf Day:
In Ontario: 158. (2) For all purposes of law, as of the date of the making of an adoption order, the adopted child becomes the child of the adoptive parent and the adoptive parent becomes the parent of the adopted child; as if the adopted child had been born to the adoptive parent. 165. (1) Despite any other Act, after an adoption order is made, no person shall . . . permit the inspection . . . of information that relates to the adoption . . . or disclose or permit the disclosure of such information.
You're a good legal researcher I see. I don't think this says that it is wrong to state that someone's children are adopted - it relates primarily to the fact that you are not allowed to reveal confidential information about the adoption process itself does it not? I don't know for sure though so I'll have to ask an expert in this area such as my Family Law professor. In any event, I do remember from Family Law last year that under the "Children's Law Reform Act" all children, including "illegitmate" children are now equal in status, which was not the case historically. It is not okay to discriminate against a child based on its status, but I don't think it's prohibited to publish that a child is adopted. Interestingly I was just reading that it has been published in the US papers that the children of Supreme Court Justice Nominee Roberts are adopted. [ 04 August 2005: Message edited by: Aric H ]
From: Canada | Registered: May 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
jeff house
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 518
|
posted 04 August 2005 06:33 PM
I don't see how any law could prevent someone from mentioning the fact that someone was adopted. It would violate the Charter. The sections Wilf linked to certainly don't say that, they are much more narrowly drawn.
From: toronto | Registered: May 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
Aric H
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 5815
|
posted 04 August 2005 06:54 PM
quote: Originally posted by jeff house: I don't see how any law could prevent someone from mentioning the fact that someone was adopted. It would violate the Charter. The sections Wilf linked to certainly don't say that, they are much more narrowly drawn.
Well that's what I suspect as I indicated above. It certainly seems to be something that both Canadian and American newspapers mention so that is why I am assuming that it is within the parameters of freedom of speech - not that newspapers always know the law, but normally they do.
From: Canada | Registered: May 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
Panama Jack
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6478
|
posted 04 August 2005 07:29 PM
quote: Originally posted by Aric H:
I am not aware of it being wrong to publish the adoption status of children.
As an adoptee I heartily agree ! Hiding away from the fact seems to indicate some sort of attached shame to the act.
From: Vancouver | Registered: Jul 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
Michelle
Moderator
Babbler # 560
|
posted 04 August 2005 07:39 PM
I do, however, think it's pretty bad form to stick "adopted" in there. Does the fact that the child is adopted have anything whatsoever to do with the story? Does that particular item have any more relevance to the story than, say, the child's weight? Or IQ? "Michaelle Jean, her husband, and her 50 lb. daughter will be blah blah blah..."It's ridiculous to qualify the relationship in such a manner. If the child is adopted, Jean and her husband are the child's parents, and she is their child. Not their "adopted child". What freakin' century are we living in, anyhow? Do you think Jean does introductions that way? "Hi, I'm Michaelle, and this is my husband so-and-so, and my adopted daughter so-and-so." Or better yet, if you were introducing them to a friend of yours (which is basically what this article was doing - introducing her and her family to the reader), would you say, "Hi John, let me introduce you to some friends of mine. This is Michaelle, and her husband so-and-so, and their adopted daughter so-and-so." I don't think so! (Whoops, andrean and I cross-posted. ) [ 04 August 2005: Message edited by: Michelle ]
From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
dramaman
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 5586
|
posted 04 August 2005 08:01 PM
Boom Boom -I also went to "The Dark Side". And I though that what I read was going to make me puke. The vitriol, the hatred, the negativity (I won't cross-post examples - that would give them too much credit)....is nothing but sickening. I hope that Gir and a few others have read all 100+ posts, and appreciate the sickness of many of those minds. ~shudder~
From: SW Ontario | Registered: Apr 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Panama Jack
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6478
|
posted 04 August 2005 11:38 PM
Michelle :I guess I don't see the big deal. My parents don't introduce me has "our adopted son" but they certainly did when they first got me. It's part of my and my parents story together, and we treasure it (and certainly don't hide the fact in any way). In a similar fashion, we're being introduced to Ms. Jean's life and family, and hearing the story of their international adoption is instructive has to what kind of people they are. It's where they came from as a family! I guarentee you given some time the "adopted" title will simply disappear as it becomes common knowledge.
From: Vancouver | Registered: Jul 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
MasterDebator
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 8643
|
posted 05 August 2005 12:13 AM
quote: Originally posted by Stockholm: ... Can you imagine Harper appointing someone like Michaelle Jean as GG? He would have probably picked some miliatry man from Alberta!
I was very disappointed to hear the really tasteless remarks of Rafe Mair today. Too bad, because on environmental issues Rafe Mair is very progressive and all but endorsed Carole James and the NDP provincially, ... at a minimum, he gave an explicit DO NOT RE-ELECT recommendation on the BC Liberals. As usual, Stockholm, you've managed to sink to the bottom of the opposing barrell. If someone from Alberta who had been in the military was intelligent and bilingual and had been decorated I suppose, would the fact that person is a white male necessarily disqualify them in your eyes? Suppose the Albertan were an Aboriginal who had been in the Forces? I was hoping for an aboriginal appointment, or possibly Rick Hansen. Would that not meet your particular needs?
From: Goose Country Road, Prince George, BC | Registered: Mar 2005
| IP: Logged
|
|
Shane
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4328
|
posted 05 August 2005 12:47 AM
quote: Originally posted by Stockholm: Let's give credit where credit is due. This is probably about the best appointment martin could possibly have made. Can you imagine Harper appointing someone like Michaelle Jean as GG? He would have probably picked some miliatry man from Alberta!BTW: In Australia all the GG's tend to be old white men who are "Sir...so and so" and usually they are military men. We are, like, so far ahead of them!
As I've stated, I am thrilled with this appointment. I think she's an inspirational woman who will bring excellence to the post. However, there are plenty of 'white military men' who could also be excellent Governors General. Maj. Gen. Lewis Mackenzie comes to mind, as does Roméo Dallaire. [ 05 August 2005: Message edited by: Shane ]
From: Ontario | Registered: Aug 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
dramaman
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 5586
|
posted 05 August 2005 01:38 AM
Gir -"it seems as if race is the most tender point..." Oh, you HAVE been reading FD!! "I thought even social conservatives had moved beyond race... but apparantly not." Oh, you HAVE been reading FD!! "In some places, it seems as if having a black representative for Canada is a big deal...." Oh, you HAVE been reading FD!! "I think regardless of race, origin, or any other demographic, she's a CBC hack who is profoundly insignificant to Canadian identity and won't do anything to better our lives." Oh, you BELONG at FD!! "She is therefore well qualified for the job of drinking expensive champagne with her massive entourage as they tour Europe." Oh, you DEFINITELY belong at FD. Wow, you and Roy Wilson, and carfix, and all the others.... Your kinda folk, obviously.
From: SW Ontario | Registered: Apr 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
VanLuke
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 7039
|
posted 05 August 2005 01:43 AM
quote: Originally posted by Shane: [QB]However, there are plenty of 'white military men' who could also be excellent Governors General. Maj. Gen. Lewis Mackenzie comes to mind, as does Roméo Dallaire.
[quote]On March 24, 2005, Prime Minister Paul Martin announced that Her Excellency the Governor General has summoned Lieutenant-General Roméo Dallaire to the Senate. Lieutenant-General Dallaire will be sitting in the Senate as a member of the Liberal Party of Canada.[quote] http://www.nsb.com/speakerbio.asp?i_speakerid=232 Were you out of the country or just stoned? Or how do you propose to get rid of his status as senator?
From: Vancouver BC | Registered: Oct 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
VanLuke
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 7039
|
posted 05 August 2005 01:49 AM
quote: Originally posted by Gir Draxon: she's a CBC hack who is profoundly insignificant to Canadian identity and won't do anything to better our lives.
A hack??? And what have you done that is profoundly significant? Post on babble? How have you bettered the lives of Canadians?
Btw many of us DO think she's significant to Canadian identity. But then one of the nice things about this country is that you can define our identity any way you want. Just don't be so presumptious to assume you speak for the majority.
From: Vancouver BC | Registered: Oct 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
Hinterland
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4014
|
posted 05 August 2005 02:07 AM
quote: she's a CBC hack who is profoundly insignificant to Canadian identity and won't do anything to better our lives. She is therefore well qualified for the job of drinking expensive champagne with her massive entourage as they tour Europe.
Oh, Lord. Which parts of that did you actually come up with yourself, Gir and which parts of that are just a verbatim parroting of some rightwing drivel you heard during the day? (...I'm guessing you came up with the punctuation all on your own). You don't even know what a hack is.
From: Québec/Ontario | Registered: Apr 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
MasterDebator
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 8643
|
posted 05 August 2005 02:22 AM
quote: Originally posted by VanLuke: Were you out of the country or just stoned? Or how do you propose to get rid of his status as senator?
What's the bit about stoned all about? Maybe we need another rolleyes in here. I guess the idea is that he could have been appointed to the Governor General's post instead. Or did I miss something? It's clear that both conservatives and some on the left cannot simply congradulate Michaelle Jean and Prime Minister Martin, too, on the appointment of a talented person who also represents some under-represented groups in Canada. Everyone has to get down and extract additional hard political mileage, and to accuse the other of being the only one playing target group politics. Which is kind of funny, yet kind of disgusting when you see the intensity with which they go at it. They obviously aren't learning anything and have no intention of doing so.
From: Goose Country Road, Prince George, BC | Registered: Mar 2005
| IP: Logged
|
|
asterix
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 2419
|
posted 05 August 2005 02:22 AM
Reading some of the comments on the Trawna Star and Grope and Flail websites today, it was quite obvious that some people were twisting themselves into pretzels to avoid explicitly saying they objected to the choice of a black woman.It was a fascinating reminder that racism really hasn't gone away; a lot of people are just too polite to admit it. [ 05 August 2005: Message edited by: asterix ]
From: deep inside the caverns of my mind | Registered: Mar 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
VanLuke
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 7039
|
posted 05 August 2005 02:58 AM
quote: Originally posted by MasterDebator:
What's the bit about stoned all about? Maybe we need another rolleyes in here. I guess the idea is that he could have been appointed to the Governor General's post instead. Or did I miss something?
You obviously missed the fact that he got appointed some months ago. Duh. Do you suggest Martin take away his post as senator? (He couldn't do that) Or should he be like our Mayor and wear both hats? Can you be senator AND GG? I don't think so. Yes, it seems we do need another rolleyes.
From: Vancouver BC | Registered: Oct 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
VanLuke
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 7039
|
posted 05 August 2005 03:00 AM
MasterDebator And you could have had the decency of actually reading my comment about her appointment before throwing mud my way. Show me where I was aiming for political mileage, or whatever your term is. edited to add what I did say other than in my comment to Gir and the one you objected to, i.e. appointing a man as GG who is a senator: quote: What a choice! It warms my heart (even though I'm no monarchist either). No matter what Martin's intentions may have been.
[ 05 August 2005: Message edited by: VanLuke ]
From: Vancouver BC | Registered: Oct 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
MasterDebator
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 8643
|
posted 05 August 2005 03:27 AM
quote: Originally posted by VanLuke: You obviously missed the fact that he got appointed some months ago.Duh. Do you suggest Martin take away his post as senator? (He couldn't do that) Or should he be like our Mayor and wear both hats? Can you be senator AND GG? I don't think so. Yes, it seems we do need another rolleyes.
Duh yourself. I think you're reading skills are a bit below normal. Any reasonable person would have interpreted it as saying that Martin could have appointed Dallaire as Gov Gen INSTEAD of appointing him to the Senate. I tried to point that out to you but nothing takes. Maybe you're the one who's a bit inebriated.
From: Goose Country Road, Prince George, BC | Registered: Mar 2005
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
VanLuke
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 7039
|
posted 05 August 2005 03:56 AM
MasterDebator showing off your debating skills by insulting me? Haven't had anything to drink and you're the one who can't read or comprehend things in their context. Or maybe you would have also preferred some 'white military man' as GG. Now you can go and fly a kite if you feel like it. psst he was appointed four months ago.
Expletive deleted [ 05 August 2005: Message edited by: VanLuke ]
From: Vancouver BC | Registered: Oct 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
|
skdadl
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 478
|
posted 05 August 2005 08:00 AM
quote: Originally posted by montrealais: I was really amused by the people kvetching about A SECOND woman of colour as GG.Were the 117 consecutive years of white males from 1867 to 1984 just not enough?
Like, yeah, eh?
From: gone | Registered: May 2001
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
|
Kevin_Laddle
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 8163
|
posted 05 August 2005 12:03 PM
I dont see why every1 is jumping on Gir... He isn't being racist or anything. And everytime I read his posts at the FD, he is usually disagreeing, or pissing off the regulars their, so don't lump him in with that group. And he does have a point. Mme Jean is certainly underqualified to be a head of state. I, like the majority of Canadians had never even heard of her. She was just one of many CBC journalists, and far from the most prominent. I would say that Peter Mansbridge, Ian Hanomansing, Don Newman, Ron MacLean, Don Cherry, Wendy Mesly, Rick Mercer, among others, have contributed a lot more to journalism in Canada and are a lot better known. And I don't even think any of those people are suitable for the GG job, with the possible exception of Mansbridge. But then again, the job is essentially meaningless, so I'm really not too concerned one way or the other.
From: ISRAEL IS A TERRORIST STATE. ASK THE FAMILIES OF THE QANA MASSACRE VICTIMS. | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged
|
|
Hinterland
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4014
|
posted 05 August 2005 12:10 PM
quote: I, like the majority of Canadians had never even heard of her. She was just one of many CBC journalists, and far from the most prominent. I would say that Peter Mansbridge, Ian Hanomansing, Don Newman, Ron MacLean, Don Cherry, Wendy Mesly, Rick Mercer, among others, have contributed a lot more to journalism in Canada and are a lot better known.
I think a lot of francophones would certainly disagree with you. I'm constantly baffled by anglophones who consider their experience of the country to be the default one. My point being is that, by convention, the GG would be coming from the francophone community this time, and in my experience, very few prominent francophones, who operate chiefly within the francophone community, are that well-known to anglophones (the reverse can also be true, to a surprising extent). I don't even think there's anything terribly wrong with that. Michaëlle Jean has been a media personality in French-language television for quite some time. I met her briefly around 10 years ago, and most francophones knew of her. [ 05 August 2005: Message edited by: Hinterland ]
From: Québec/Ontario | Registered: Apr 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
Erstwhile
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4845
|
posted 05 August 2005 12:14 PM
quote: Originally posted by Kevin_Laddle: Mme Jean is certainly underqualified to be a head of state. I, like the majority of Canadians had never even heard of her.
So I take it "underqualified" = "not famous enough"? I mean, really, and more seriously...What qualifications do you actually need to be Governor-General? But that said, Jean is an accomplished woman and, given the nature of the post, a good choice. Perhaps that's damning with faint praise given my dislike for the G-G position generally... I'm glad to see Jean appointed, actually. The G-G is a useless post but not a meaningless one, IMO.
From: Deepest Darkest Saskabush | Registered: Jan 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
Boom Boom
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 7791
|
posted 05 August 2005 12:36 PM
From the official GG pages: The Governor General of Canada is also Commander-in-Chief of the Canadian Forces. As such, the Governor General plays a significant role in encouraging excellence and recognition of the military’s place in Canadian life and in Canada’s international responsibilities. - snip - Upon appointment, the Commander-in-Chief receives the Canadian Forces decoration and becomes an Honorary Colonel of the Governor General’s Foot Guards, the Governor General’s Horse Guards and the Canadian Grenadier Guards; the Chancellor and a Commander of the Order of Military Merit
From: Make the rich pay! | Registered: Dec 2004
| IP: Logged
|
|
Hinterland
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4014
|
posted 05 August 2005 12:48 PM
quote: Hinter, I said the majority of Canadians have never heard of her. Your response was essentially "she is really popular in Quebec". Well yes, I never said otherwise, and my initial point still stands.
Exactly. And I'm saying you don't have a meaningful point. If you're playing a numbers game, anything specific to the francophone community will hardly ever be an issue to the "majority of Canadians" since francophones constitute 25% of the country's population. By the way, I notice you're from Ontario; you do realise that there are francophones outside of Québec, right?...Why, half a million of them right there, in your own province, even.
From: Québec/Ontario | Registered: Apr 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
Kevin_Laddle
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 8163
|
posted 05 August 2005 01:11 PM
quote: Originally posted by Hinterland:
Exactly. And I'm saying you don't have a meaningful point. If you're playing a numbers game, anything specific to the francophone community will hardly ever be an issue to the "majority of Canadians" since francophones constitute 25% of the country's population.
Since when do prominent francophones have to be "specific" to the francophone community? There have been many who have made an impact on Canada as a whole. And since the GG represents Canadians as a whole, this is important. My entire point is that if someone is "specific" to one group of Canadians, whether it is Albertans, Torontonians, or Quebecers, they are not a good choice for GG.
From: ISRAEL IS A TERRORIST STATE. ASK THE FAMILIES OF THE QANA MASSACRE VICTIMS. | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
Hinterland
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4014
|
posted 05 August 2005 01:27 PM
quote: Since when do prominent francophones have to be "specific" to the francophone community? There have been many who have made an impact on Canada as a whole.
I'm not sure what you're talking about, anymore. Some francophones have stature among a greater spectrum of Canadians than just francophones, but I'd guess most act solely within the limits of their own cultural communities. That's how life generally works. In any case, outside of politicians, who do you have in mind? Céline Dion? Blaque Jacques Shelaque?... . We had a thread on this a while back, and some of the suggestions were Marc Garneau, Antonine Maillet, etc. Jean appears to be a selection in that type, although I don't remember her name being suggested.
From: Québec/Ontario | Registered: Apr 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
Shane
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4328
|
posted 05 August 2005 02:17 PM
quote: Originally posted by VanLuke: MasterDebator showing off your debating skills by insulting me? Haven't had anything to drink and you're the one who can't read or comprehend things in their context. Or maybe you would have also preferred some 'white military man' as GG. Now you can go and fly a kite if you feel like it. psst he was appointed four months ago.
Expletive deleted [ 05 August 2005: Message edited by: VanLuke ]
Sorry, I was suggesting that had Dallaire not been appointed to the Senate, he could have been made Governor General.
From: Ontario | Registered: Aug 2003
| IP: Logged
|
|
Wilf Day
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 3276
|
posted 05 August 2005 06:39 PM
quote: Originally posted by Kevin_Laddle: I don't think that is much preparation for being a Head of State, especially in a minority government situation.
A BA in Italian and Hispanic languages and literature. An MA in comparative literature. Taught at the Faculty of Italian Studies. Pursued linguistic and literary studies at the University of Perouse, the University of Florence and the Catholic University of Milan, all of which cited her for excellence. Fluent in five languages: French, English, Italian, Spanish and Creole. Worked for eight years with Québec shelters for battered women. Was also involved in aid organizations for immigrant women and families, and later worked at Employment and Immigration Canada and at the Conseil des Communautés culturelles du Québec. For 18 years, she has been a highly regarded journalist and anchor of information programs.Well, it's hard to think of better preparation for a leadership position in Canada. Aren't linguists good at seeing different viewpoints? Aren't shelter workers good at being supportive of the vulnerable? Aren't journalists good at analyzing the full range of the human condition? In this age of over-specialization, aren't they as good as lawyers? Even better, since too many lawyers are also becoming over-specialized?
From: Port Hope, Ontario | Registered: Oct 2002
| IP: Logged
|
|
capebretoner
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 7806
|
posted 05 August 2005 07:13 PM
quote: Originally posted by Shane:
Sorry, I was suggesting that had Dallaire not been appointed to the Senate, he could have been made Governor General.
Not that it really matters, but for the record to clear up the argument about Dallaire/senate/gg, just because he was appointed as a senator a few months ago does not mean that he couldn't have still been appointed gg. He would simply resign from the senate to take the gg post. He would not hold both at the same time as VanLuke I believe asked. I believe Romeo Leblanc was a senator when he was appointed although I could be wrong.
From: blah blah blah | Registered: Jan 2005
| IP: Logged
|
|
obscurantist
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 8238
|
posted 05 August 2005 08:04 PM
quote: Originally posted by Kevin_Laddle: Mme Jean is certainly underqualified to be a head of state. I, like the majority of Canadians had never even heard of her. She was just one of many CBC journalists, and far from the most prominent. I would say that Peter Mansbridge, Ian Hanomansing, Don Newman, Ron MacLean, Don Cherry, Wendy Mesly, Rick Mercer, among others, have contributed a lot more to journalism in Canada and are a lot better known. And I don't even think any of those people are suitable for the GG job, with the possible exception of Mansbridge.
Agreed that there are many Canadians more prominent than Michaelle Jean, and even many CBC personalities more prominent (and with more experience) than Jean. Also agreed that most of the names you mention wouldn't be suitable GGs. But this goes to the point I tried to make by raising the prospect of Cherry as Governor-General: being well-known to Canadians is not necessarily an indicator of how well one would do in this particular job.
From: an unweeded garden | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged
|
|
|
Webgear
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 9443
|
posted 05 August 2005 08:56 PM
A few stories about the GG from a soldier’s viewAfter the friendly fire accident in Kandahar, the current GG visited the wounded soldiers in Germany. She got them some cold beer and then proceed to have a few drinks with them and to listen to their stories. and During the New Years Eve party in 2004, the current GG brought a few rounds of drinks for the soldiers deployed in Kabul. She spent a lot of her own money to be with the soldiers on that special night. I am sure the new GG will be just as good as the last GG. I think she will take the military to places it needs to be at
From: Montgomery's Tavern | Registered: May 2005
| IP: Logged
|
|
|