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This year I decided to wear a 'Council of Canadian's' button stating: "War is not the answer".

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Originally posted by Red Albertan:
I read only a few postings, and haven't had much time to spend on babble lately, but I am also one of the people who will not wear a poppy. My reason is because I oppose all wars, not just WWI.

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Originally posted by 'lance:
I've concluded that when someone uses the word "noble" as a term of praise (that is, they're not simply referring to this or that titled unemployable, snoozing in the House of Lords), they're spreading sheepshit in the hope that something beautiful will grow.

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Originally posted by Sven:
Even civil war? As in violent "revolution"?

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That is sad. There are a lot of noble people at all levels of society and all walks of life.

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... and a vain hope it is, typically.

[ 13 November 2005: Message edited by: 'lance ]

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Originally posted by voice of the damned:
I wonder what the CoC's "answer" would be if American troops just decided to march into Canada one day.

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The right never really believed in Smith's invisible hand of laissez-faire. Their gods are Mars and the golden calf.

[ 13 November 2005: Message edited by: Fidel ]

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The idea of an alternative poppy dates back to 1926, just a few years after the red poppy came to be used in Britain. A member of the No More War Movement suggested that the British Legion should be asked to imprint 'No More War' in the centre of the red poppies and failing this pacifists should make their own flowers.

In 1933 the Co-operative Women's Guild produced the first white poppies to be worn on Armistice Day (later called Remembrance Day). The Guild stressed that the white poppy was not intended as an insult to those who died in the First World War - a war in which many of the women lost husbands, brothers, sons and lovers. The following year the Peace Pledge Union joined the CWG in the distribution of the poppies and later took over their annual promotion.

The White Poppy symbolises the belief that there are better ways to resolve conflicts than killing strangers.

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Originally posted by M. Spector:
How about wearing a White Poppy?

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Not a bad idea.

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Originally posted by Red Albertan:

I oppose a country invading another country. That is never justified.

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We invaded Italy, France, Belgium, Holland and Germany during WWII. Are you saying those were all unjustified?

I wear a poppy because I feel sorry for the Canadian & Newfoundlander soldiers who died in the First World War, and proud of those who fought in the Second.

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Originally posted by NewlessCluebie:
We invaded Italy, France, Belgium, Holland and Germany during WWII. Are you saying those were all unjustified?

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No, the Allies didn't invade those countries. They responded to declarations of war and invasions initiated by the Nazis against Britain and its colonies. (The events that led up to the Nazis being able to come to power and initiate invasions of other countries is another matter)

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I wear a poppy because I feel sorry for the Canadian & Newfoundlander soldiers who died in the First World War, and proud of those who fought in the Second.

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...and the survivors of those wars - and the organization that speaks for them - still to a large degree support wars, as noted previously. I will not support such culture of war.

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I have a hard time taking absolute pacifism seriously because if someone claims that violence is never justified, the obvious reply is "so what are you going to do about it?"

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Originally posted by Red Albertan:

I oppose a country invading another country. That is never justified. Revolutions and Civil War are sometimes the result of an uprising against political corruption and rot. I am opposed to them if they are externally instigated and artificially stoked, but if it is a genuine uprising of the people against their oppressors, I am not opposed.

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Originally posted by Red Albertan:
I oppose a country invading another country. That is never justified.

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Originally posted by Red Albertan:

Defense against an invader by any means is justified. .

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Of course the irony here is that all of North America was formed from the armed invasion of the independent nations of Turtle Island and is still maintained as a militarized occupation.

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I don't know about calling it "irony".

For arguments sake though, let's accept the premise that Canada is "occupied territory". What then? Perhaps you have a vision of our fair land as something other? What would it be, who would govern it and what would it's polity be?

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Originally posted by Ginger Jar:
For arguments sake though, let's accept the premise that Canada is "occupied territory". What then? Perhaps you have a vision of our fair land as something other? What would it be, who would govern it and what would it's polity be? Difficult questions, but worth discussing, I think.

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Over the past year harrowing first-hand testimonies from North Korean defectors have detailed execution and torture, and now chilling evidence has emerged that the walls of Camp 22 hide an even more evil secret: gas chambers where horrific chemical experiments are conducted on human beings.
Witnesses have described watching entire families being put in glass chambers and gassed. They are left to an agonising death while scientists take notes. The allegations offer the most shocking glimpse so far of Kim Jong-il's North Korean regime.

Kwon Hyuk, who has changed his name, was the former military attaché at the North Korean Embassy in Beijing. He was also the chief of management at Camp 22. In the BBC's This World documentary, to be broadcast tonight, Hyuk claims he now wants the world to know what is happening.

'I witnessed a whole family being tested on suffocating gas and dying in the gas chamber,' he said. 'The parents, son and and a daughter. The parents were vomiting and dying, but till the very last moment they tried to save kids by doing mouth-to-mouth breathing.'

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Originally posted by Red Albertan:
No, the Allies didn't invade those countries. They responded to declarations of war and invasions initiated by the Nazis against Britain and its colonies. (The events that led up to the Nazis being able to come to power and initiate invasions of other countries is another matter).

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Actually if you want to nitpick, Britain declared war on Germany, not the other way around.

Of course, I think it was justified, but you're the one who said it was never justifiable for one country to invade another. I'm glad you've clarified your claim to say that self-defence is OK.

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If you don't take the time to read people's posted position before stating things like the above, you deserve to have your position equally ignored. I oppose (unprovoked) invasions of other countries, not the act of resistance by any means against such invaders. People have the right to peace, and be protected from the force of the stronger. Any country disrespecting such basic human rights and invading another country deserves to have the living daylights bombed out of them by the united rest of the world. One man's opinion. I speak for nobody but myself.

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That's great. You weren't making your position clear at first.

[ 15 November 2005: Message edited by: NewlessCluebie ]

[ 15 November 2005: Message edited by: NewlessCluebie ]

I lost a friend this year. He landed at Juno Beach with the Fort Garry Horse. He would never talk about the war. If I asked him about what it was like he'd find some funny story to tell me. One time, though, he mentioned how an old French woman thanked him personally for liberating her country from the Nazis. he said her words helped him deal with the memories of what he had to do during the war.

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Originally posted by NewlessCluebie:
That's great. You weren't making your position clear at first.

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Your first post in this thread responded to a post by Red Albertan in which he said the following:

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Revolutions and Civil War are sometimes the result of an uprising against political corruption and rot. I am opposed to them if they are externally instigated and artificially stoked, but if it is a genuine uprising of the people against their oppressors, I am not opposed.

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Originally posted by voice of the damned:

I wonder what the CoC's "answer" would be if American troops just decided to march into Canada one day.

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You're right. The Yanks are the only country to ever threaten our sovereignty with military force.
We should put a few more hosers on border duty. ha