Personally I don't have A/C, nor have I ever lived in a house with A/C. Yes it sucks in some ways (hard to sleep at night is the biggest), but do we need these things? I understand the need for certain people, elderly or others with serious health concerns, but for EVERYONE? I mean it gets to ridiculous levels where some people have their houses freezing (colder than they coincidentally tolerate in the winter) when I don't think its even necessary for the vast majority of people to even have A/C.

I was complaining about the heat to a friend recently who lives in Dubai (more that its my nature to complain). And I realised how silly I must have sounded. Yes summers are hot here, but they aren't THAT hot. There are people around the world who deal with a lot worse and get by just fine. So instead of just dealing with it we create conditions where we need profuse amounts of energy. We already take so much to stay warm in the winter where I think its necessary, but not now.

I didn't know where to put this complaint, it can be partly blamed on being "bitter" but I think there is a serious problem with the culture behind A/C. Problems with power distribution is another serious concern. Maybe sharing some secrets with ways to beat the heat.

What I find the most ridiculous about the home A/Cing is that people have it going all day - they could be out at a public space that has A/C if it becomes unbareably. Go to a park, incourage clean beaches, etc.

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Yes it sucks in some ways (hard to sleep at night is the biggest), but do we need these things?

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The summer before we bought our a/c our apartment was so hot that everything in it felt hot. If you touched the couch, or the bed, or the dresser, it felt hot to the touch. Candles in candlesticks melted, like a Dali painting. And sadly my employer expects me to show up for work, whether I've slept or not.

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Originally posted by Mr. Magoo:
I don't disagree that they can be abused, but trust me, for about a week there, "think cool thoughts" or "take another shower" just weren't cutting it.

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[ 28 June 2005: Message edited by: Agent 204 ]

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Originally posted by Mr. Magoo:

The summer before we bought our a/c our apartment was so hot that everything in it felt hot. If you touched the couch, or the bed, or the dresser, it felt hot to the touch. Candles in candlesticks melted, like a Dali painting. And sadly my employer expects me to show up for work, whether I've slept or not.

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I can understand under certain circumstances. But honestly - I live in an oven right now - but I certainly haven't maxed out on "cool living". Not to say there are certain buildings that should not be A/C'd or that there are not any legitimate personal uses.

I guess I am only speaking from my experience of house living. Houses don't "necessarily" need A/C - even at some of their worst construction. People can get buy and live normal productive lives.

I think this absolute comfort at all cost mentality is just crazy. It costs an exorbitant amount of money to refigerate houses - and what I have noticed is that this habit has only made living in the heat even more unbearable. Places that unreasonably air condition their premises drive people to go from one fridge to the next hiding from something that for most people in most cases is not a problem - and I can say that with a relative insurance because I personally know people and human history can tell us of billions who live perfectly fine.

It's possible to buy a cheap little 5000 btu unit that will either chill one room, or gently cool a small apartment. That's what we have. It doesn't add dramatically to our hydro bill, so I'm assuming it's not a huge hydro-hog.

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Originally posted by Hawkins:
I certainly understand the apartment building problem specifically. I guess my anger is directed more at suburbia.

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That said, I think air conditioning culture sucks and I won’t get one. I refuse to just give in and buy cold air when I think there are much more effective means of creating a normal climate. Ripping out half of the concrete in every city, for example. And I dislike very much being asked to buy my way out of the heat when I know that’s an option unavailable to people with lesser means. Who now have less pay phone boxes, of course, because doesn’t everyone just have their own personal cellphone now?

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Originally posted by saskatchewan:
This issue infuriates me. Partly because I live in a baking hot apartment. It’s overheated even in the dead of winter. And why? No air circulation.

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You know Hailey, I might be able to put up with a political difference (reference to the auntie.com thread), but if I were your husband I'd divorce you over the AC issue.

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I myself would never buy an air conditioner. There's something about air conditioned spaces that feel unnatural to me - it would be like turning my home into a department store. Back when I lived in hell*, I had an apartment with a south facing window that drew in all the heat it could. Any food left out of fridge became melty really quick so I know horrible heat and humidity. But even then I didn't feel the need of an air conditioner. I got a good fan that oscillated around the main room of the apartment and that was fine. I never understood the need for air con, when a fan is just as effective and (AFAIK) takes up much less energy. The only problem was that my chum refused to keep the fan on a night because he thought it was unhealthy and could give you some sort of temporary paralysis. I never bought that, but given the timing of those arguments (at night), I could never be bothered to find out if it was true.

Re the poster who mentioned fur coats and air conditioning, I witnessed a similar thing at a party in Beverly Hills when the hostess asked the maid to crank the A/C because she wanted to have the fireplace going.

In offices, air conditioning is especially gross because that dirty air is just being recycled around and around. A lot of colds, flu and other illness could be prevented by not using it.

Edited to add: Night fan use causing temporary paralysis? How? From somnambulistic amputations?

[ 13 July 2005: Message edited by: EFA ]

A trivial tangent, perhaps, but the AC helped me to decide that the five kitties had just become, for their sakes and mine, indoor kitties forever, and that has worked. In the old place, in a Toronto summer, I just couldn't do that to them, but they seem to be ok now.

I hate having all the windows closed, though. In fact, I don't. If energy efficiency means closing all the windows, I just can't do that. So I'm coping by doing a lot of on-off-on-off of the AC.

I certainly agree with Cougyr about the Romans:

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Most of what it takes to make a building comfortable is low tech. 2000 years ago, Romans, among others, were building in central air chambers and water cooling systems. No, the reason we have such uncomfortable buildings is that they are easier and cheaper to put up and the end user can pay for the heating and cooling.

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Not to mention the Arabs, and the lovely courtyard homes that spread to Spain, Sicily and elsewhere...

Living in central Italy, the centuries-old block of flats I was living in was delightfully cool in the summer, with its thick brick walls and tile floors. (Carpets come out in wintertime).

But now, the pall of smog has done away with the cooling breezes in the evenings. Italians and French people hate air conditioning, and it is far less common than here. But two summers ago the heat/pollution wave was such that a lot of fragile elderly people died sooner than they would have otherwise in those countries (isolation was a factor, but even in care homes there is rarely air conditioning). Now there is a call to have at least one air-conditioned space in care homes and other places people with respiratory problems can be taken for respite.

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Originally posted by Hailey:

LOL! I am not the wrong one here. Who wakes someone up to ask them how they can sleep in this temperature?

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Low-tech A/C method: you could try this old trick. Buy a bag of party ice, dump it on a tray and put the tray in front of your fan. The air rushing past cools off because the heat in it goes to warming the ice.

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Apartments are a pain because the landlord doesn't care if you bake.

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I heard something on the radio this morning saying that some people are questioning whether it should be made part of a building requirement/code for all apartments to have air conditioners installed in them because people are dying from the heat. The arguement is that they make buildings safer. I didn't get much detail but wondered whether these idiots had heard about the record electricity use Toronto has been experiencing!

That being said, I confess to having a window a/c, which I inherited from an old roommate, in my bedroom. I don't use it alot. In fact I didn't even put it out last summer. I can handle the heat during the day but at night I'm perfectly miserable when, as someone mentioned, everything feels warm to the touch and there is absolutely no air circulation. My apartment is exposed to the sun from all sides and not close to any trees so it just bakes and does not cool down much at night.

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So I'm coping by doing a lot of on-off-on-off of the AC.

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I'm not breathing well, and nothing is getting done around our apartment because it is too hot to move. Two fans don't make a difference. My husband can't get any writing done, I'm on vacation and haven't been able to much of the research I was planning to do done, and the dishes and laundry are piling up.

But I've resisted getting one for so long, so I feel a bit defensive. But I've started to get physical feelings of panic when I'm too hot and sweaty for too long. On the other hand, I'll try to resist turning it up too high.

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Originally posted by Gir Draxon:
When I saw the thread title on the main page, I was worried that the Tesla vs. Edison debate was heating up again...

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I like winter more. I am not a big summer fan.

Don't tell me I'm the only winter-hater on this frigging board? That is worth than Québec/RoC or Palestine/Israel issues!

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Have any of you thought of those fine-dispersion plant-sprayers

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Originally posted by DrConway:

Low-tech A/C method: you could try this old trick. Buy a bag of party ice, dump it on a tray and put the tray in front of your fan. The air rushing past cools off because the heat in it goes to warming the ice.

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Only thing is, wouldn't that add to the humidity of the air?

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Originally posted by Melsky:
We broke down and got an air conditioner too. We got one of the tiny 100 dollar ones and it seems to work ok. My husband had to go to the emergency room last week. They thought it was a heart attack but his heart checks out ok. We are wondering if it could have been heat stroke because ever since then he's had a very hard time with the heat! He's usually not at all bothered by heat, I'm the one who melts in the heat and loves cold.

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Yikes. I'd be inclined to get it too under those circumstances. But on the bright side you could really throw your friends back in California for a loop by calling them and whining about how Canada is a great place, but it's too damn hot.

I'm not among those who find air conditioning unpleasant, or who think fans are just as good. I just can't justify getting it myself, given that I can manage without it (for the time being, at least).

[ 14 July 2005: Message edited by: Agent 204 ]

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Originally posted by Agent 204:
Funny you should mention that. I heard a University of Waterloo engineering student interviewed on CBC with this very suggestion a few weeks ago, talking about it as if it were some bold new invention he had come up with.
Only thing is, wouldn't that add to the humidity of the air?

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The way to solve that would be to leave a window open and ensure you have air circulation. That way at least the humidity never exceeds that of the surrounding air.

To describe to all of you outside southern Ontario what we've been enduring for the past week I will say this: highs in the mid to high 30s, with humidexes in the high 30s to low/mid 40s. With no end in sight! That's too hot! This is one big city gal that has had it! (please note excessive use of exclamation points is due to the weather. BCG Inc apologizes for any over exposure to exclamation points)

Of course there are places in the world that are hotter, but Toronto homes were designed to keep IN the heat.

For the record, I'm a polar bear, I love the cold and get crabby and whiny in the heat (defined by me as anything tipping over 27). This season I installed an air conditioner and am never leaving my living room again.

Seriously: google talc. I think it is now definitely considered carcinogenic.

On the other, if it can cause cancer in my ovaries (as it may have), then maybe it is just generally not a good thing.

Thread drift: The guy in the hospital bed next to me when I was in St. Anthony (Nfld) last week came down with a terrible rash on his legs, and another neighbour suggested talcum powder would help. I guess the guy never used the stuff before, because he proceeded to empty A FULL CAN of the stuff on his legs and on the floor (whereupon a nurse slipped but fortunately was not injured). Later, at night, he did the same thing, again, and the room had a strong perfume smell so I had to open a window. I was gasping from the smell, the powder was just a couple of feet away.

edited for language.

[ 14 July 2005: Message edited by: Boom Boom ]

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Originally posted by skdadl:
Is he home yet, Michelle?

I'll hold off the rain dance until Michelle Jr gets home, but then I'm going out to shout at the skies.

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Just keep the power on! (Possibly) 11 floors up with no A/C is a Toronto experience we could ALL do without.

I will never get acclimatized to humid heat. (Dry heat, I can tolerate. Cold damp, ditto. Just not heat and humidity at the same time.) If I am going to be a productive person, I need to sleep, and if that means from time to time powering up ol' Bessie, then so be it. This summer's been bad. Last summer, I don't think her services were required at all. Or maybe once.

Most of the time, I can rely on the passive cooling that my grandparents used to practice all summer, living as we did without wires or plumbing. In the day, you keep the curtains drawn and the windows closed. At night, you open everything up but the mosquito screens, bank your cold, and hope it gets you through the next day. You don't cook much. You do heavy chores in the early morning or at dusk. Simple, common-sense stuff.

What gets me, is that during the blackout of '03, my office was closed down, and they only let people in with the caveat to only use the appliances that were strictly necessary, unplug "ghost" appliances that use juice even when off, and -- the kicker -- the building AC wouldn't be on at all. However, at night and early morning, they would run the ventilation system to suck cool night air into the building to at least get through to early afternoon at a reasonable temperature.

My grandparents' common-sense, scaled up. WHY CAN'T THEY DO THIS ALL THE TIME???!?!?!?!?!?

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Originally posted by Boom Boom:
It's still cool here; not cold, but cool, just right. Most times we need a jacket to go anywhere but this afternoon was not one of those days - actually quite warm around noon today at 22C which is unusual for us this early. Still very dry all over, we need rain.

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BB, in the winter, places like Florida and the resort islands employ meteorologists to tell them when to crank up the advertising in key northern markets.

In the summer, places like Labrador, Newfoundland, and the LNS ought to be doing the same thing in reverse!

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Originally posted by dee:
Does anyone here use one of those window fans that blow air in on one side and out on the other? How well do they work in extreme heat? I'm thinking about getting one after work today but don't want to waste the money if it doesn't make much difference.

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Originally posted by lagatta:
Boom Boom, that was not nice. Sometimes you are a spoilt child, although you are a few years older than me.

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History has been revised, been revised, been revised,
History has been revised, in time with Edvard Grieg.

[ 14 July 2005: Message edited by: pebbles ]

I found one anti-Québec post in his recent posting history but don't really feel like wading through everything he wrote.

Such attacks out of the blue are very strange.

Edited to add: Thanks, boom boom.

[ 14 July 2005: Message edited by: lagatta ]

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Originally posted by Boom Boom:
I greatly prefer a cool day to a warm one. However, there's still a couple of drawbacks for anyone contemplating a visit here: we now have mosquitoes as well as blackflies; and, the waters of the Gulf are simply frigid.

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EXACTLY!

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I haven't seen anyone in the water yet, and it's mid-July.

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I'll be the first (provided there's a wharf to jump off of; wading would make me wuss out.)

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This has been the coldest, strangest summer I've experienced in ten years on the Lower North Shore. Last winter as well - the most snow, and the coldest weather I've seen in ten years. I'm starting to dread what next winter might bring.

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