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» babble   » from far and wide   » bc, alberta, saskatchewan   » No to minimum wage hikes, yes to 40% pay raises for execs

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Author Topic: No to minimum wage hikes, yes to 40% pay raises for execs
Fartful Codger
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posted 08 August 2008 03:51 PM      Profile for Fartful Codger     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Rich get richer in BC, poor get SFA.

CBC.ca

quote:
The top 100 bureaucrats in the provincial government will receive salary increases as large as 43 per cent, all in a bid to attract and keep top executives, B.C.'s minister responsible for labour market development said Friday.

Murray Coell defended the estimated $4 million in salary increases as a move necessary to keep pace with the rest of the country.



From: In my chair | Registered: Apr 2005  |  IP: Logged
keglerdave
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Babbler # 5839

posted 09 August 2008 12:27 AM      Profile for keglerdave     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Seeing as there is a shortage of truck drivers in the industry, I guess I can point to the Fiberals lavish pay packages for deps and asst deps, and ask for a similar pay increase when we go into collective bargaining in 2009.
From: New Westminster BC | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged
munroe
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posted 09 August 2008 06:46 AM      Profile for munroe     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
If the Campbell Liberals were to be consistent, then it would be recruiting top bureaucrats under the temporary foreign worker programme it loves so dearly.
From: Port Moody, B.C. | Registered: Jun 2007  |  IP: Logged
Fartful Codger
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posted 09 August 2008 03:55 PM      Profile for Fartful Codger     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Well, I think it's fucking outrageous. Look, I actually agree that we should pay quality people what they're worth. This includes giving MLAs decent salaries and it includes giving top bureaucrats good compensation.

But this is the province with a growing gap between rich and poor. This is symbolic of a government that just wants to look after their friends in high places. So until they take some steps and make sure everyone benefits, these kinds of raises send the wrong message: A $105,000 RAISE for the deputy to the premier? Come on!


From: In my chair | Registered: Apr 2005  |  IP: Logged
jas
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posted 09 August 2008 08:43 PM      Profile for jas     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Fartful Codger:
Well, I think it's fucking outrageous. Look, I actually agree that we should pay quality people what they're worth. This includes giving MLAs decent salaries and it includes giving top bureaucrats good compensation.

Actually, I don't agree with this philosophy at all. If these people can command these high salaries in the private sector, then that's where they should be. Why aren't they there? Usually because they're no longer top game in their field and they get an appointment in the public service.

The public service used to be about public service. It's not about big taxpayer-subsidized salaries. Campbell's constant meddling with the remuneration scale has nothing to do with paying people what they're "worth".

Nor do I approve of overly large salaries for MLAs. For one thing, it offers an incentive to public service that should not be there. And for another, it raises the bar such that certain types of people - potential representatives of you and I - might be excluded simply based on economic class or perception of "success".

Modelling government remuneration on corporate remuneration is misguided. Yes, we don't want our public reps to be bought by private interests, but I don't think a system in which they earn scores of thousands more than the bulk of their constituents do is at all democratic.

Government salaries should be indexed to average or median income for the region in question (in this case, the province as a whole - I don't mean the individual ridings), and bonuses or increments should be based on performance: if government's doing a good job and citizens are benefitting from a thriving and sustainable economy that has long term viability, then a modest raise may be appropriate. If things aren't doing so well, and many people are suffering, a raise would not be available.

This is why people business types like Gordon Campbell do not belong in government. They don't understand the difference.


From: the world we want | Registered: Jun 2005  |  IP: Logged
Fidel
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posted 09 August 2008 09:09 PM      Profile for Fidel     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Fartful Codger:
Well, I think it's fucking outrageous. Look, I actually agree that we should pay quality people what they're worth. This includes giving MLAs decent salaries and it includes giving top bureaucrats good compensation

Well that pretty much excludes Liberals there as well as here in Ontariariario.


From: Viva La Revolución | Registered: Apr 2004  |  IP: Logged
keglerdave
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posted 09 August 2008 11:24 PM      Profile for keglerdave     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Jas...

Campbell and his cronies actually have it figured out. Business types in government have an endless supply of money to blow on their friends and families. In business, its perfectly acceptable to engage in the behaviours that are now being inflicted in government. Its how the rich get richer, while the average taxpayer continually takes it up the butt. One only needs to look at Ken Dobell to see the type of person that people in BC accept in government. Pigs at the Trough would be an understatement. Conflict of interest... in BC there's no such thing anymore.

But then again... we do "get the government we deserve."


From: New Westminster BC | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged
grumpydigger
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posted 12 August 2008 09:49 PM      Profile for grumpydigger        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
KING Campbell believes he has no reason to worry about the ndp in the next election so he can do as he pleases... He also believes the people have extremely short memory's ,, teacher and nurses were held down to small percentages but the fools in government get obscenely high increases........
From: kelowna bc | Registered: Aug 2008  |  IP: Logged
MCunningBC
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Babbler # 14903

posted 12 August 2008 10:35 PM      Profile for MCunningBC        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by jas:
The public service used to be about public service. It's not about big taxpayer-subsidized salaries. Campbell's constant meddling with the remuneration scale has nothing to do with paying people what they're "worth".

Nor do I approve of overly large salaries for MLAs. For one thing, it offers an incentive to public service that should not be there. And for another, it raises the bar such that certain types of people - potential representatives of you and I - might be excluded simply based on economic class or perception of "success".

Modelling government remuneration on corporate remuneration is misguided. Yes, we don't want our public reps to be bought by private interests, but I don't think a system in which they earn scores of thousands more than the bulk of their constituents do is at all democratic.

Government salaries should be indexed to average or median income for the region in question (in this case, the province as a whole - I don't mean the individual ridings), and bonuses or increments should be based on performance: if government's doing a good job and citizens are benefitting from a thriving and sustainable economy that has long term viability, then a modest raise may be appropriate. If things aren't doing so well, and many people are suffering, a raise would not be available.


This is a very detailed set of considerations, with a lot of hedging and some contradictions.

OTOH, you say compensation must be high enough that bribery isn't attactive to government officials, but OTOH, the salaries and increases must be such that legislators make average pay, which in BC right now is about $21 or $22 per hour across all occupations. IOWs, about $40 to $45 thousand per year.


From: BC | Registered: Jan 2008  |  IP: Logged
grumpydigger
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posted 13 August 2008 09:00 AM      Profile for grumpydigger        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
==OTOH, you say compensation must be high enough that bribery isn't attactive to government officials== With these increases the criminal act has all ready been done ....bribery would just be icing on the cake.........
From: kelowna bc | Registered: Aug 2008  |  IP: Logged
Politics101
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posted 22 September 2008 03:30 PM      Profile for Politics101   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Noticed this press release about the raises today on the government web site - so here it is;

quote:
VICTORIA – The salaries of every deputy and assistant deputy minister in the BC Public Service have now been reviewed and decisions have been made on the actual salary levels assigned to each individual executive member under the new compensation framework introduced in August.

As a result of this review, effective Aug. 1 the average actual pay for deputy ministers is $217,758, representing an average increase of just over seven per cent. The average salary under the new framework for assistant deputy ministers is $157,608, representing an average increase of 21 per cent. The deputy minister to the Premier has opted not to accept any increase in salary at this time.

The increases provided also reflect that the value of the salary holdback has been increased from five per cent to 10 per cent of each executive’s annual pay. The holdback of each executive’s salary is dependent on their performance on a series of specific measures linked to building the corporate human resources of the BC Public Service. In real terms, that means on average up to almost $22,000 of deputy minister salaries and $16,000 in assistant deputy minister salaries are at risk if performance measures are not met. B.C. is the only jurisdiction to have such a system in place to ensure ongoing performance.

Prior to the 2008 adjustment, assistant deputy minister salaries ranked tenth in Canada among other provinces and the federal government, and deputy minister salaries ranked sixth. Under the new framework, the maximum achievable salaries for both levels of executives in B.C. rank third in Canada, providing greater flexibility to be competitive in a tight labour market.

With the decisions on actual salary levels, the actual average salaries for B.C. deputy ministers and assistant deputy ministers are estimated to now rank fifth amongst the other Canadian jurisdictions. From now on, the deputy minister compensation framework will be set at 83 per cent of federal salaries and will be subject to the same regular review cycle to ensure ongoing competitiveness.

Forecasts show that within 10 years over 65 per cent of assistant deputy ministers and 51 per cent of deputy ministers will be eligible to retire. In a tight labour market, compensation levels are one key factor in ensuring the BC Public Service is able to recruit and retain suitably qualified senior professionals.



From: Vancouver | Registered: Apr 2005  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
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Babbler # 490

posted 27 September 2008 09:11 AM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Shoot, I'll be a Deputy Minister of just about anything for $100k a year, never mind $150-$200K.
From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Boom Boom
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Babbler # 7791

posted 27 September 2008 09:20 AM      Profile for Boom Boom     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Money can't buy happiness. Can't buy me love, either. And, I hear money is the root of all evil.*
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.sorry, I felt like trolling today.

From: Make the rich pay! | Registered: Dec 2004  |  IP: Logged
G. Pie
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Babbler # 15576

posted 29 September 2008 06:33 PM      Profile for G. Pie     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Stuff this like just makes me nuts. Most of the work done by bureaucrats doesn't need to be done in the first place. We had a medical situation earlier today and a family member needed to be checked out at the hospital. We waited for hours. Stretchers were stacked two deep. Nurses were clearly at the end of their rope. Grab a brain, Campbell. What the f*** does the Ministry of Health spend our money on? We just don't need so many levels of bureaucracy. (Rant, rave, growl.) Just one example: how much money does the Ministry of Health waste billing for MSP? Couldn't all BC residents be assumed to be covered and couldn't that amount be a line item on our tax returns? If the pleas for money are anything to go by, it seems cancer research, hospitals, etc. are heavily dependent on public donation. This is nuts. I wouldn't give a penny to feed that machine.
From: Vancouver Island | Registered: Sep 2008  |  IP: Logged

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