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Author Topic: "Free" power saves much oil crossing Atlantic
bliter
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posted 22 January 2008 12:29 PM      Profile for bliter   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I think that oil prices going the way they are, that we will see much more such innovation. A very good thing.

I'm a little puzzled by the illustration at the bottom of the article, where the kite appears to be pulling against the forward motion of the cargo ship - unless, of course, the kite is being retrieved.

Towin' in the Wind


From: delta | Registered: Sep 2007  |  IP: Logged
farnival
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posted 22 January 2008 12:40 PM      Profile for farnival     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
that illustration is confusing, but as they say in the article, the kite can be used with "side winds", or in sailing parlance, that would be on the beam. if you look at that kite as being beside the ship, the perspective being kinda wonky, then it makes sense. the kite pulls the ship sideways, but that action is countered by the keel and rudder, causing forward movement. exactly how a sailboat works, but without, as they say, the bothersome mast.

the irony of course would be to use these on ships transporting oil.


From: where private gain trumps public interest, and apparently that's just dandy. | Registered: Jul 2004  |  IP: Logged
bliter
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posted 22 January 2008 01:17 PM      Profile for bliter   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
farnival,

Yes, as a rag-hauler, I get what you're sayin'. And if used by all oil tankers, a good thing.

A thought occurs. If one kite can achieve such savings, consider two or more. In the final days of sail, of course, some of those tea and wool clippers
were moving at speeds above many of today's cargo vessels - and this on wind alone.


From: delta | Registered: Sep 2007  |  IP: Logged
farnival
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posted 22 January 2008 01:29 PM      Profile for farnival     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
aye matey, right you are. there is a catamaran company that is experimenting with multi-kite propulsion, not to mention Lagoon, who has, i think the first mass market electric propulsion boats, primarily directed at the charter business.

it is funny, considering the speeds of the clippers you mentioned, why sail power isn't considered more for the big ships. you could easily combine kites/sails with a diesel/electric engine for backup/inshore work until full electric becomes commercially viable.

i'm waiting for a decent outboard replacement. there is no reason in my mind that the 4 stroke Honda 7.5 auxilliary outboard on the Catalina 22 i sail on couldn't be replace with an electric motor. they have them, but are not really for boats that size. If we can split atoms, and budget for that, why can't we figure out fossil fuel-less propulsion?


From: where private gain trumps public interest, and apparently that's just dandy. | Registered: Jul 2004  |  IP: Logged
bliter
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posted 22 January 2008 01:53 PM      Profile for bliter   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
After all this talk about sail, just had to visit this "clipper" site. The pictures of these ships under full sail give me goose bumps. A top speed of 22 knots is mentioned. That would have put a real hum through yer rope-soled sandals:


Function and Beauty

ETA

This may pee off fans of the Cutty Sark.

excerpt:

quote:
There are many ways of judging the speed of a ship: by knots per hour (sic), by day's runs, by port-to-port records. Judged by any test, the American clippers were supreme.

Donald McKay's Sovereign of the Seas reported the highest rate of speed ever achieved by a sailing ship - 22 knots, made while running her easting down to Australia in 1854. (John Griffiths' first clipper, the Rainbow, had a top speed of 14 knots... ) There are eleven other instances of a ship's logging 18 knots or over. Ten of these were recorded by American clippers...

Besides the breath-taking 465-mile day's run of the Champion of the Seas, there are thirteen other cases of a ship's sailing over 400 nautical miles in 24 hours...

And with few exceptions all the port-to-port sailing records are held by the American clippers.


[ 22 January 2008: Message edited by: bliter ]


From: delta | Registered: Sep 2007  |  IP: Logged
bliter
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posted 22 January 2008 04:00 PM      Profile for bliter   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
farnival,

On your desire to switch from your Honda outboard to electric propulsion, I recall recently reading of a small, harbor passenger ferry that was totally solar powered.

Also, the French, for quite a few years have been working with pleasure boats powered by photo-voltaic panels.

If, and when, you get such power, you may find it an advantage to switch all your boat's lighting to LED.

[ 22 January 2008: Message edited by: bliter ]


From: delta | Registered: Sep 2007  |  IP: Logged
KenS
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posted 22 January 2008 07:46 PM      Profile for KenS     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
i'm waiting for a decent outboard replacement. there is no reason in my mind that the 4 stroke Honda 7.5 auxilliary outboard on the Catalina 22 i sail on couldn't be replace with an electric motor. they have them, but are not really for boats that size. If we can split atoms, and budget for that, why can't we figure out fossil fuel-less propulsion?

Look around. This has to be a piece of cake. You have your electric motor that's lighter than the gas engine it replaces, balances similar and easily enough, and runs at speeds probably close to the gearbox specs of the outboard.

Battery placement is simpler than it is in a car.

I'm sure someone has already invented this particular wheel- and may even sell ready to 'plug in' conversion components. Outboards with blown engines have to be very cheap to come by. Free? Have on in your garage already?

Some of the auto EV conversion companies also do boats. I've never looked at that stuff so can't recomend where to start.

There's also small scale turbines for masts, turbines in the water, etc. Some of these would be relatively cheap to start adding.

http://www.ev-america.com/boats.html

Is one site. I've seen others with boat apps. That webpage has a picture of an outboard conversion. Unfortunately there is no real website- but they are quick with emailing canned packages.

[ 22 January 2008: Message edited by: KenS ]


From: Minasville, NS | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
jester
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posted 22 January 2008 08:02 PM      Profile for jester        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Here ya go farnival:

sailpower

There is lots of technology out there for blowboats - motors,solar,wind etc. its mostly geared for the budget cruisers who want to go around the world on a head full of dreams and a pocket full of lint.

Its great if you don't mind hiding behind a headland for a month waiting for the wind to change or the seas to moderate but I prefer lots of diesel power.


From: Against stupidity, the Gods themselves contend in vain | Registered: Jan 2006  |  IP: Logged
bliter
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posted 22 January 2008 09:47 PM      Profile for bliter   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
And the beauty of the displacement-hulled sailboat, with electric auxiliary power, is that the batteries can also serve as interior ballast. The weight concerns that would accompany converting an ICE car to EV do not apply.

So even with a whole stack of the most economical car batteries that you have charged at the marina, you will have excellent range when those winds are mere zephyrs or non-existent. Include a substantial photo-voltaic array and, if it's your desire, you may circle the globe.

Good luck. Keep in touch.


From: delta | Registered: Sep 2007  |  IP: Logged

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