babble home
rabble.ca - news for the rest of us
today's active topics


  
FAQ | Forum Home
  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» babble   » archived babble   » the middle east and central asia   » Did American Marines murder 23 Iraqi civilians?

Email this thread to someone!    
Author Topic: Did American Marines murder 23 Iraqi civilians?
Cueball
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4790

posted 26 March 2006 07:41 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
The Independent

quote:
US military investigators are examining allegations that Marines shot unarmed Iraqis, then claimed they were "enemy fighters", The Independent on Sunday has learned. In the same incident, eyewitnesses say, one man bled to death over a period of hours as soldiers ignored his pleas for help.

[Note to Michelle, I know you will be tempted to close this and add it too the "Air Carange" thread, but I would ask you not to, because the title "Air Caranage" doesn't really capture what is being talked about; deiliberate slaying of civilians by US forces. )]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4790

posted 26 March 2006 07:45 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Similarly

quote:
According to Iraqi police, 11 bodies were pulled from the wreckage of the house, among them four women and five children aged between six months and five years. An official police report obtained by a US reporter for Knight Ridder newspapers said: “The American forces gathered the family members in one room and executed 11 people.”

[SNIP]

The two incidents are being investigated by US authorities, but persistent eyewitness accounts of rampaging attacks by American troops are fuelling human rights activists’ concerns that Pentagon commanders are failing to curb military excesses in Iraq.


Military "excesses." People just don't seem to appreciate how serious it is to take someones life without a clear reason for doing so. Excess? Murder, more like it.


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4790

posted 27 March 2006 09:53 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Troops accused of mosque massacre

quote:
A senior aide to Sadr, in comments capable of inflaming passions among the radical cleric's supporters, accused US troops of shooting dead more than 20 unarmed worshippers at the Mustapha mosque after tying them up. The mosque's faithful follow Sadr but the aide denied they were Mehdi Army gunmen.

"The American forces went into Mustapha mosque at prayers and killed more than 20 worshippers," Hazin al-Araji said.

"They tied them up and shot them."



From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4790

posted 27 March 2006 11:28 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
The Gruesome Reality of Operation Swarmer

quote:
But while the public is fed rosy propaganda, the reality is far more gruesome. Take, for example, the operation in Isshaqi, a small village near Samarra. At 1:30am on Tuesday, March 21, the American troops, accompanied by helicopters , raided the modest rural home of a primary school teacher, Faiz Mratt. According to his neighbor Mohammad Al-Majma, the 27-year-old school teacher, his wife, their three children, his sister, her three children, his father and a woman who was visiting them were all arrested, tied, and beaten, and then the American troops opened fire on the family. "After they executed them, the troops put explosives in the house and blew it up," said Mohammad, crying. "They killed even the farm animals"



From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
unionist
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 11323

posted 27 March 2006 06:50 PM      Profile for unionist     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Political storm over mosque deaths

Now the Iraqi Interior Minister has condemned the slaughter by the U.S. of 18 men who were praying when their mosque was invaded:

quote:
US officials said 16 insurgents had been killed and 18 captured, along with a significant weapons cache.

However, members of Iraq's ruling Shia Islamist bloc say many of the dead were civilians taking part in prayers.

"Entering the mosque and the killings there are an unjustified and flagrant attack," the interior minister said.

"Approximately 18 innocent men who were inside the mosque performing sunset prayers were killed and became martyrs," Bayan Jabr added in an interview on Dubai-based al-Arabiya television. "They were killed unjustly and wrongfully."

Some members of the ruling Shia Islamist alliance repeated allegations - denied by US officials - that Americans and Iraqi troops under their command had tied people up at the Mustafa mosque in north-east Baghdad's Sadr City up and shot them in cold blood.

Baghdad Governor Hussein Tahan said all co-operation with US forces would be suspended unless the incident was investigated by a panel not including the US military.


Maybe it's time for the Americans to run for their lives?


From: Vote QS! | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4790

posted 28 March 2006 04:42 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
US troops defend raid, say Iraqis faked "massacre"

quote:
BAGHDAD (Reuters) - U.S. commanders in Iraq on Monday accused powerful Shi'ite groups of moving the corpses of gunmen killed in battle to encourage accusations that U.S.-led troops massacred unarmed worshippers in a mosque.


"After the fact, someone went in and made the scene look different from what it was. There's been huge misinformation," Lieutenant General Peter Chiarelli, the second-ranking U.S. commander in Iraq, said.


He rejected the accusations of a massacre that prompted the Shi'ite-led government to demand U.S. forces cede control of security but declined to spell out which group he believed moved the bodies.



From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
thwap
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 5062

posted 28 March 2006 07:40 AM      Profile for thwap        Edit/Delete Post
"The US military is investigating" ...

I hate that line. It's supposed to make us feel warm and fuzzy: The Rule of Law, Protocols, Checks and Balances, Institutional Responsibility, etc.,

..."can't comment during the ongoing investigation"

Obviously. This latest massacre might be just as "inconclusive" as the last massacre. Even if it's an open and shut case, some barely sentient shit-stain like Rosie Dimanno will earn her keep by writing an apologia for it.


From: Hamilton | Registered: Feb 2004  |  IP: Logged
Frustrated Mess
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 8312

posted 28 March 2006 09:24 AM      Profile for Frustrated Mess   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
The Evolution of a US Investigation:

quote:
As outrage over the incident erupted in Iraq, Washington sought to distance itself from the killings. The shifting US account of the incident suggested a crude attempt at cover-up. Initially, Centcom, the US regional military command, reported that 16 “insurgents” had been killed in a raid conducted by US and Iraqi troops in Adhamiyah, a former Baathist stronghold, where Saddam Hussein was seen surrounded by a cheering crowd after the US invasion had begun.

As it became indisputable that the action had been carried out not against Sunni insurgents in Adhamiyah, but rather a mosque in a nearby Shiite neighborhood, US authorities backpedaled on the role played by the American military. "This was an Iraqi planned and led operation and US forces were only in an advisory capacity," a State Department spokesman declared Monday.

The corpses, however, were surrounded by shell casings from 5.56mm bullets, the ammunition issued exclusively to US troops in Iraq. Parts of the mosque had been damaged by fire, substantiating witness accounts that the building had been struck by rockets fired from US warplanes.

Witnesses also reported that before the shooting, helicopters were seen hovering over the neighborhood, while armored Humvees sealed off surrounding streets.


Asian Tribune

And the spin:

quote:
Facing a scathing backlash from Shiite Muslim leaders a day after a deadly U.S.-Iraqi raid in Baghdad, top U.S. military officials defended the mission Monday, saying it was a "hugely successful" operation against an insurgent hideout packed with weapons used against soldiers and civilians.

Seattle Times

Whenever there is so much blood and so many mangled bodies it is always hugely successful.


From: doom without the gloom | Registered: Feb 2005  |  IP: Logged
Américain Égalitaire
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 7911

posted 28 March 2006 09:42 AM      Profile for Américain Égalitaire   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
If the US was afraid of a civil war, they're certainly doing their damndest to get one started.

So we carry forth our reputation as the killers of children and innocents and then blame the murders on the victims.

The Americans can launch all the investigations they want - I don't believe a word that comes from any of them. Perhaps its because I went to a school at Ft. Benjamin Harrison Indiana where I witnessed firsthand how officers were trained to lie.

You read that right.

Bastards. They make me ashamed that I ever wore the uniform.


From: Chardon, Ohio USA | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged
thwap
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 5062

posted 28 March 2006 12:30 PM      Profile for thwap        Edit/Delete Post
Remember the massacre of the wedding party in the desert?

There's some controversy: The woman and the few children who were wounded but survived were interviewed for a European news channel, said that they were at a wedding celebration and that the US troops and helcopters came out of nowhere, killing everyone for no reason.

The US insisted that they took small arms fire from the location and that they'd killed a number of insurgents. When the Army spokesperson was forced to concede that there had been a celebration going on, he witlessly blathered "bad people have parties too."

You don't know who to believe, y'know? The US government or the victims of a massacre. Sometimes victims lie. Unless they're victims of communist governments. Then it's insensitive and cruel in the extreme to be skeptical of their stories.

[ 29 March 2006: Message edited by: thwap ]


From: Hamilton | Registered: Feb 2004  |  IP: Logged
Transplant
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 9960

posted 28 March 2006 02:58 PM      Profile for Transplant     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by thwap:
The US insisted that they took small arms fire from the location...

It's my understanding that firing guns in the air is a common, if dangerous, means of celebration at weddings in the Middle East.


From: Free North America | Registered: Jul 2005  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4790

posted 29 March 2006 06:17 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
It is even, according to an Iraqi blog I read a system of communication used in rural areas. The blogger described how he and a friend were in the country trying out a revolver. Presently, a local came by in his car after hearing the gunshots and offered his condolences for the death of his father, signalled apparently by the patern of fire.

Interestingly, this blogger a dentist whose views were generally pro-american (actually I'd say rabidly pro-Amreican) were quite shaken up when he family reported to him that his nephew was thrown off a bridge by American GI's. He used his position to appeal to the CPA for investigation, but I don't know what happened after that.

Perhaps he is dead now.


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
eau
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 10058

posted 29 March 2006 01:18 PM      Profile for eau        Edit/Delete Post
I have never held a gun in my hands, ever. If I lived in Iraq , which thankfully I do not, I would own a gun for protection. The guns that came to the doors of the houses of this family in Iraq were unfortunately bigger and better. Five of the children were under 6 years of age.

And yes, it is traditional to use guns to celebrate weddings and festive occasions in certain Middle East countries, akin to firecrackers in the west.


From: BC | Registered: Aug 2005  |  IP: Logged
thwap
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 5062

posted 29 March 2006 01:23 PM      Profile for thwap        Edit/Delete Post
Remember when US soldiers sent in pictures of dead and wounded Iraqis (sometimes surrounded by triumphal US soldiers) to the porn site "nowthatsfuckedup.com"? Photos with captions like "Die Haji Die!!" and "Nice Puss, Bad Leg" [of a young woman with her leg blown off and lying in the ambulance in such a way as to expose her]?

The US military investigated that one too. They determined that they couldn't trace where the e-mails with the pictures originated from and they couldn't prove that the dead and wounded Arabs surrounded by US troops were actually Iraqi.


From: Hamilton | Registered: Feb 2004  |  IP: Logged
al-Qa'bong
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 3807

posted 02 April 2006 06:02 PM      Profile for al-Qa'bong   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Information about this atrocity seems to have been buried already, although Lt. Calley's trial took place almost two years after the My Lai massacre.

Will anyone in the US military ever face trial for the war crime of the invasion of Iraq?


From: Saskatchistan | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged

All times are Pacific Time  

   Close Topic    Move Topic    Delete Topic next oldest topic   next newest topic
Hop To:

Contact Us | rabble.ca | Policy Statement

Copyright 2001-2008 rabble.ca