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Author Topic: New Iraqi president a moron?
Cueball
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Babbler # 4790

posted 07 April 2005 10:27 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Ceremonial gaffe mars appointment of Iraqi Prime Minister

quote:
The solemnity of the moment yesterday was marred when the new Iraqi President, Jalal Talabani, mysteriously left the ceremony. When he reemerged he explained that he had momentarily forgotten the name of the new Prime Minister whom he was appointing.

Dr Jaafari, the mild-mannered leader of the Islamic Dawa Party, did not look disturbed by Mr Talabani's sudden memory loss. But other members of the United Iraqi Alliance, the Shia coalition which won a majority in the 275-member parliament in the election on 30 January, saw it as a possible bad omen for future relations between Kurds and Shias. Abbas Hassan al-Bayati, a leader of the Alliance, complained: "This happened because of sheer bad management."



From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 490

posted 07 April 2005 10:39 PM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
He couldn't have made up a better excuse, or even just left it at an unspecified personal matter?
From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Doug
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Babbler # 44

posted 07 April 2005 10:53 PM      Profile for Doug   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Poor fellow can't even remember his lines. This isn't good.
From: Toronto, Canada | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
swallow
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Babbler # 2659

posted 08 April 2005 01:36 PM      Profile for swallow     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Jalal Talabani, President of Iraq. That will take some getting used to.

It's like imaging Canadian Prime Minister Gilles Duceppe.


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Cueball
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4790

posted 08 April 2005 03:50 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
That is a very cogent observation. I do not see the Arabs feeling very comfortable with having the people of the ram ruling Asyria from the seat of Abbysiad Caliphs for very long. Just to day I was talking to a pro-war Christian Iraqi (Assyrian) who had not very pleasant things to say about this coccurence.

[ 08 April 2005: Message edited by: Cueball ]


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remind
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posted 08 April 2005 03:56 PM      Profile for remind     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Is Talabani not CIA, from long ago? He also knew on March 17th, the job was his.
From: "watching the tide roll away" | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
WingNut
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Babbler # 1292

posted 08 April 2005 04:10 PM      Profile for WingNut   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Talabani: Take the example of Ahmad Chalabi, whom you already mentioned. The United States of America proposed that Chalabi be the main actor—not the leader—in the INC. Then it turned out that Chalabi was not in complete compliance with CIA policy. In particular, he favored an armed struggle inside Iraq, and to do this, he wanted to found an INC army; in contrast, the CIA wanted the INC to look to a military coup and not develop any kind of military forces to fight against the Iraqi army. He wanted to have armored forces and work on the ground against Iraq; they wanted to use the INC for propaganda campaigns. So the U.S. government changed its mind about Chalabi and began to hate him. First he had been beloved inside the CIA, then he was hated there.

MEQ: You blame all the INC’s problems on the CIA?

Talabani: Look, Chalabi is a clever man and a real leader of the opposition against Saddam Husayn. He has dedicated his life to change in Iraq. At the same time, he was not someone experienced in politics, having not participated in any political parties before his founding the INC.

MEQ: What conclusions do you draw from this?

Talabani: That no single person can lead the Iraqi National Congress; it must have a collective leadership.

MEQ: Do you see the U.S. government having a role in helping to bring about unity among the Kurds of Iraq?

Talabani: Very much so. The United States had a role, has a role, and will have a role if—and put two lines under that if—if the United States is serious. If the United States is working seriously, it can do a lot.


The neo-con's man in Iraq


From: Out There | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 09 April 2005 02:03 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
It could also have been some deliberate and petty insult.
From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Hephaestion
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posted 09 April 2005 04:29 AM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Cueball:
That is a very cogent observation. I do not see the Arabs feeling very comfortable with having the people of the ram ruling Asyria from the seat of Abbysiad Caliphs for very long. Just to day I was talking to a pro-war Christian Iraqi (Assyrian) who had not very pleasant things to say about this coccurence.

Cueball —

I have been interested in this stuff since I first read some info. on Suliman the Magnificent (sp?) a few years ago in National Geographic... part of my curiousity was the fact that we learned absolutely *nothing* about the history of this area of the world in school (too focused on dead Limey kings, dag-nabbit!)

Can you explain your references, and maybe point me to a good site (or even a book)? I'd appreciate it muchly. (Although gawd knows when I'll ever get timeto READ another book!)


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Cueball
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posted 09 April 2005 07:09 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Akkoyunlu (white sheep) and Qarakoyunlu (Black Sheep) were too competing kingdoms ethnically related to the Turcomen but also incorporating ethnic Kurds from the region north of Baghdad. They competed with and were eventually incorprated into the Ottoman empire around 1500.

The Abbasid Caliph's are the most important and longest lasting Dynasty of the Sunni tradition of Islam. They reign more or less co-incides with what is known as the golden age of Islam. Purportedly descended from the direct liniage of Muhammed's uncle. They were the direct inheritors of the Arab empire of Mohammed after the original four Caliph's known as the Umayyad's.

The Umayyads are recoginzed by both Shia and Sunni traditions but it is the coming of the Abbasid's that signals the break between the Shia and Sunni traditions. The Shia recognize Ali, husband of Mohammed's daughter Fatima, as the legitimate heir to the tradition of Islam.

I believe the Umayyads are the decendants of the brother of Mohammed.

I think thats right, and I am doing it from memory but it is very complex.

My understanding is that the essential philosphical difference is that the Sunni Muslims draw far more interpretation of the Qu'ran from the Sunna (the way -- lifestyle?) of Mohammed, while the Shia put more strict emphasis of the Qu'ran. A Caliph is not necessesarily a religious leader, but the leader of the Ulama (community) on the other hand in the Shia tradition people are led by an Mullah who interpets the Qu'ran.

The Caliph of Baghdad by no means ruled all of the Muslim world, and other Caliph's and dynasties existed in parralel (the Fatimids in North Africa -- Cairo, and a branch of the Umyyad's in Anadalusa -- Cordoba, to name a two.) Nonetheless, Baghdad is hugely signficant politcally for the Arab people, as it was the center of the most potent civilization they raised, and at the heart of the Sunni tradition.

Its from memory, so corect away scholars.

[ 09 April 2005: Message edited by: Cueball ]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged

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