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Author Topic: The End of a Viable Palestinian State
WingNut
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posted 01 April 2005 08:02 PM      Profile for WingNut   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Israel cannot "digest" the 3.6 million Palestinians living in the Occupied Territories. Giving them citizenship would nullify Israel as a Jewish state; not giving them citizenship yet keeping them forever under occupation would constitute outright apartheid. What to do? The answer is clear: establish a tiny Palestinian state of, say, five or six cantons (Sharon's term) on 40-70% of the Occupied Territories, completely surrounded and controlled by Israel. Such a Palestinian state would cover only 10-15% of the entire country and would have no meaningful sovereignty and viability: no coherent territory, no freedom of movement, no control of borders, no capital in Jerusalem, no economic viability, no control of water, no control of airspace or communications, no military--not even the right as a sovereign state to enter into alliances without Israeli permission.

Jeff Halper


From: Out There | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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Babbler # 4790

posted 01 April 2005 11:40 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
So we are back to the pre-1948 Arab position of unified secular state, or never ending boot of Zionist facism.
From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
CMOT Dibbler
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Babbler # 4117

posted 02 April 2005 09:05 AM      Profile for CMOT Dibbler     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Those aren't the only possibilities. The American Empire has less than 15 years left to it. This means that the Israeli government will not be able to keep funding the occupation and will have to completely withdraw from the West Bank and gaza. They won't be able to complete the wall or convince Jews to settle on Palestinian land.
A viable Palestinian Republic can be founded on 22% of historic Palestine. Is it a perfect solution? No, but it's a start.

[ 02 April 2005: Message edited by: CMOT Dibbler ]


From: Just outside Fernie, British Columbia | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
nister
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posted 02 April 2005 10:25 AM      Profile for nister     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Another scenario: Iran gets the bomb. Arab states get a lot more aggressive in conventional hostilities. Israel finds scruples, retreats to pre-1967 borders.
From: Barrie, On | Registered: Dec 2004  |  IP: Logged
CMOT Dibbler
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Babbler # 4117

posted 02 April 2005 10:38 AM      Profile for CMOT Dibbler     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by nister:
Another scenario: Iran gets the bomb. Arab states get a lot more aggressive in conventional hostilities. Israel finds scruples, retreats to pre-1967 borders.

Is Iran working on the Bomb? I thought they were using Nuclear technology to build power plants.

question: Isn't Iran hated by it's Arab neighbors?

[ 02 April 2005: Message edited by: CMOT Dibbler ]


From: Just outside Fernie, British Columbia | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
AppleSeed
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posted 02 April 2005 11:26 AM      Profile for AppleSeed     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Originally posted by CMOT Dibbler:

quote:
Is Iran working on the Bomb? I thought they were using Nuclear technology to build power plants.

You should check out what what Ayatollah Ali Akbar Hashemi-Rafsanjani has to say.

quote:
One of Iran’s most influential ruling cleric called Friday on the Muslim states to use nuclear weapon against Israel, assuring them that while such an attack would annihilate Israel, it would cost them "damages only".


quote:
"Jews shall expect to be once again scattered and wandering around the globe the day when this appendix is extracted from the region and the Muslim world", Mr. Hashemi-Rafsanjani warned, blaming on the United States and Britain the "creation of the fabricated entity" in the heart of Arab and Muslim world.

Yeah, it would wipe out a lot of Palestinians, but they would be "damages only". And at least the Jews would be once again driven from the area.


From: In Dreams | Registered: Mar 2005  |  IP: Logged
CMOT Dibbler
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Babbler # 4117

posted 02 April 2005 12:06 PM      Profile for CMOT Dibbler     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by AppleSeed:
Originally posted by CMOT Dibbler:

Yeah, it would wipe out a lot of Palestinians, but they would be "damages only". And at least the Jews would be once again driven from the area.



This is Iranian rhetoric. I didn't ask whether some factions in the Iranian government
want to use a nuclear bomb against Israel (they most certainly do). I asked whether they were constructing one.


From: Just outside Fernie, British Columbia | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
AppleSeed
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posted 02 April 2005 01:47 PM      Profile for AppleSeed     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I would say it's a good bet.
From: In Dreams | Registered: Mar 2005  |  IP: Logged
al-Qa'bong
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posted 02 April 2005 04:18 PM      Profile for al-Qa'bong   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Sounds like the Mother-in-law of all battles to me.
From: Saskatchistan | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged
gCato
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posted 02 April 2005 11:43 PM      Profile for gCato        Edit/Delete Post
Some here seem not to have heard that Israel possesses a huge arsenal of A weapons.
From: British Columbia | Registered: Apr 2005  |  IP: Logged
Macabee
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posted 03 April 2005 08:07 AM      Profile for Macabee     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Yeah, it would wipe out a lot of Palestinians, but they would be "damages only". And at least the Jews would be once again driven from the area.


Please tell me that this is inappropriate sarcasm. If not folks we have a problem

From: Vaughan | Registered: Mar 2004  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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Babbler # 478

posted 03 April 2005 08:31 AM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Having read AppleSeed for a bit, I think that it is the former, Mac.
From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
al-Qa'bong
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Babbler # 3807

posted 03 April 2005 11:29 AM      Profile for al-Qa'bong   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I think the "we" is appropriate here.

Appleseed's on your side, Mac.


From: Saskatchistan | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged
AppleSeed
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posted 03 April 2005 02:42 PM      Profile for AppleSeed     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I held up a mirror to Rafsanjani and his words. You may see in there as you wish, Mr. Qa'bong.
From: In Dreams | Registered: Mar 2005  |  IP: Logged
CMOT Dibbler
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Babbler # 4117

posted 03 April 2005 03:48 PM      Profile for CMOT Dibbler     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by AppleSeed:
I would say it's a good bet.

Yes, but do you have any proof?


From: Just outside Fernie, British Columbia | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4790

posted 03 April 2005 08:22 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by al-Qa'bong:
I think the "we" is appropriate here.

Appleseed's on your side, Mac.



Does Macabee actually have a side? I envision something more along the lines of this slippery twisting helix, existing close to a chronsynclastic infundibulum.

[ 03 April 2005: Message edited by: Cueball ]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Briguy
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Babbler # 1885

posted 04 April 2005 09:45 AM      Profile for Briguy     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Well people, if you haven't learned to ignore AppleSeed by now, it's your own damn fault.
From: No one is arguing that we should run the space program based on Physics 101. | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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Babbler # 478

posted 04 April 2005 09:48 AM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Lost interest, Mac?
From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
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Babbler # 490

posted 04 April 2005 07:17 PM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Israel: No Building Plans for West Bank

quote:
Israel's housing minister said Monday his government had no immediate plans to go ahead with the construction of 3,500 new homes on the West Bank.

"In my ministry, this is all theoretical at this stage," Isaac Herzog said at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy.


Sharon pledges settlement growth

quote:
Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon has pledged to go ahead with the expansion of a Jewish settlement near Jerusalem fiercely opposed by Palestinians.

He said 3,500 homes would be built to link to form a corridor between the city and the largest West Bank settlement, Maale Adumim.


Hmm. How interesting. Israeli government speak with forked tongue.


From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
WingNut
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 1292

posted 04 April 2005 10:22 PM      Profile for WingNut   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Israel to dump 10,000 tons of garbage a month in the West Bank

quote:
Israel has decided to transfer garbage beyond the Green Line and dump it in the West Bank for the first time since 1967. The project was launched despite international treaties prohibiting an occupying state from making use of occupied territory unless it benefits the local population.

In addition, pollution experts say such use of the Kedumim quarry - located in an old Palestinian quarry between the Kedumim settlement and Nablus - will jeopardize Palestinian water sources.


Haaretz


From: Out There | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged

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