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Author Topic: Israeli General Strike! (follow-up)
lagatta
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posted 23 September 2004 09:11 AM      Profile for lagatta     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Here is are many other links about the Israeli General Strike. http://www.laborstart.org/middleeast/

Obviously any labour struggle must be examined in its social and political context, but I hope we can keep it on topic. I almost put this in "labour and consumption", but feared the possible consequences.


From: Se non ora, quando? | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
Briguy
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posted 23 September 2004 10:49 AM      Profile for Briguy     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Finance Minister Benjamin Netanyahu had demanded debt-ridden municipalities agree to an austerity plan before receiving a bail-out package for about 20,000 workers, some of whom had not been paid in a year.

The unions claimed victory on Wednesday on the grounds that the court ordered payment of back salaries. But the Finance Ministry also welcomed the ruling, saying it linked payments to local governments embarking on a recovery plan.


Bibi didn't pay workers for up to a year in order to force municipalities to join his neocon crusade? Holy Schmoley. That sounds more like a mob tactic than a government negotiation. What a slime.


From: No one is arguing that we should run the space program based on Physics 101. | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
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posted 23 September 2004 02:13 PM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I am wondering how those workers managed to survive for a year with no wages. Does the Histadrut have a comprehensive wage-replacement plan in the event of strikes or lockouts?
From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 23 September 2004 02:57 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
That strike lasted about as long as the Lebanese government workers strike. Actually I think it was less time than the Lebanese strike. In both cases the government ordered the workers back. There have been questions about why workers continued to work so long without pay?

The way it looks to me is that the Histadrut has a long history of being directly involved an supportive of the whole Zionist enterprise, and so it may be that it acts not only as a voice for labouir but also a control mechanism. It may very well be that the labour federation has played a significant role in actually keeping workers at work, "during the period of national crisis." A short strike may have acted as a safety valve to release tension.It is really hard to explain why they didn't walk earlier, except as an expression of loyalty ot state.

Unions have often had this function, to a greater or lesser extent. Look at the unions of Iraq under the Baath, or in the Soviet Union.

[ 23 September 2004: Message edited by: Cueball ]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
B.L. Zeebub LLD
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posted 23 September 2004 03:22 PM      Profile for B.L. Zeebub LLD     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Palestinian workers in Israel pay part of their earnings to Histradut, but are not protected by the union.
From: A Devil of an Advocate | Registered: Sep 2004  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
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posted 23 September 2004 03:23 PM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post

Where's the bloody Rand Formula when you need it?


From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 23 September 2004 03:26 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Palestinian workers in Israel pay part of their earnings to Histradut, but are not protected by the union.

It read that 6% of Histradut membership is Arab-Israeli. I don't know what protection that affords.


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
B.L. Zeebub LLD
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posted 23 September 2004 04:44 PM      Profile for B.L. Zeebub LLD     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I meant Palestinians from the Occupied Territories working in Israel.
From: A Devil of an Advocate | Registered: Sep 2004  |  IP: Logged
Macabee
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posted 23 September 2004 06:08 PM      Profile for Macabee     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
From Dr. Conway in an earlier thread on this subject:

quote:
The above is sophistry of the highest order, and transparently specious in intent. Macabee, at this point your desire to be deliberately patronizing and obtuse is clearly evident, and no excuses you make will be accepted.

Go back to increasing the entropy of the universe and stop wasting my time.


Hey Doc I see you're reading an English dictionary again.

From: Vaughan | Registered: Mar 2004  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 23 September 2004 06:10 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
None of what you quoted is even in this thread. Why not tak it to a PM, if you are so insulted.

quote:
I meant Palestinians from the Occupied Territories working in Israel.

Yes. But one wants to ask how are Israeli-Arabs protected by the union? What jobs make them eligible for those jobs and then of course why only 6% of the total number of unionists are Israeli-Arabs, when Israeli-Arabs make up 20% of Israeli citizens?

[ 23 September 2004: Message edited by: Cueball ]


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Macabee
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posted 23 September 2004 06:13 PM      Profile for Macabee     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Macabee:
From Dr. Conway in an earlier thread on this subject:

Hey Doc I see you're reading an English dictionary again.


But it is in a thread with exactly the same name.

From: Vaughan | Registered: Mar 2004  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 23 September 2004 06:19 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
You are supposed to be our resident Israelophile. given that role, it would be nice if you could enlighten us with some commentary on the history of the union movement in Israel, its role, and some of the questions that have been raised regarding the apparent contradictions regarding race and union memebrship.

It would seem that your inability to background posters here on some of the nuances of the Labour movement in Israel, might be due to lack of knowledge, rather than lack of interest. If you aren't interested why not shut up?


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
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posted 23 September 2004 06:28 PM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
It may be worthwhile to recall this book by Ze'ev Sternhell which points out that the Histadrut, while a strong proponent of labor socialism, was undercut by Ben-Gurion's relative lack of commitment to the idea.

It is Sternhell's thesis (at least partly, I think) that to some degree nationalism undercuts socialism by de-emphasizing the connection workers have with each other and substituting loyalty to the state or country, which has the effect of diminishing the importance of worker class struggle against the owners of businesses.

In effect, then, what he calls "nationalist socialism" was never all that socialist to begin with.


From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged

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