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Author Topic: Inside Abu Gharib
WingNut
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posted 20 September 2004 04:46 PM      Profile for WingNut   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
"Because I could speak a bit of English I was given the job of emptying the rubbish. There was never enough food and one day I came across an old woman who had collapsed from hunger. The Americans were always eating lots of hot food. I found some in a packet in a bin and gave it to her. They caught me and threw me in a one-metre-square punishment cell. They then poured cold water on me for four hours." She wrote the date down in her Koran: February 24 2004.

Why they hate them.

From: Out There | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
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posted 20 September 2004 05:20 PM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
That article reads like it could have been written in France in 1941.
From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
al-Qa'bong
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posted 20 September 2004 06:58 PM      Profile for al-Qa'bong   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Like most Iraqi women, Alazawi is reluctant to talk about what she saw but says that her brother Mu'taz was brutally sexually assaulted. Then it was her turn to be interrogated. "The informant and an American officer were both in the room. The informant started talking. He said, 'You are the lady who funds your brothers to attack the Americans.' I speak some English so I replied: 'He is a liar.' The American officer then hit me on both cheeks. I fell to the ground.

Alazawi says that American guards then made her stand with her face against the wall for 12 hours, from noon until midnight. Afterwards they returned her to her cell. "The cell had no ceiling. It was raining. At midnight they threw something at my sister's feet. It was my brother Ayad. He was bleeding from his legs, knees and forehead. I told my sister: 'Find out if he's still breathing.' She said: 'No. Nothing.' I started crying. The next day they took away his body."


If George Bush believes in a just God he must be beside himself with fear.


From: Saskatchistan | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged
Coyote
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posted 20 September 2004 07:07 PM      Profile for Coyote   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
God's relationship with humanity is rather predictable: S/he seems to be most on the side of whoever happens to be winning . . . kinda like a Democrat.
From: O’ for a good life, we just might have to weaken. | Registered: Jan 2004  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
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Babbler # 490

posted 21 October 2004 12:45 AM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I considered suicide, says prisoner degraded by GIs

quote:
An Iraqi detainee forced to commit degrading sexual acts in the notorious Abu Ghraib prison came face to face with his American torturer yesterday during an American court martial held outside Baghdad.

The former inmate, whose name was not released for security reasons, described how Staff Sgt Ivan "Chip" Frederick, 38, punched him and made him masturbate in front of other prisoners. "I was crying," he said, visibly distressed. "I wanted to kill myself."


That's disgusting. Said Staff Sergeant should have to wear a sign all the time that reads, "I acted like a concentration camp guard."

See how he likes them apples, although the humiliation he'll suffer won't get near what he did to that man.


From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Fidel
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posted 21 October 2004 02:47 AM      Profile for Fidel     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
It's sad. One group of prisoners on their way to Guantanamo, chained in a kneeling-prone position on a C-130 flight to Guantanamo, actually chewed through hydraulic lines running somewhere along the floor. It brought the plane down.

American's are de-sensitized to death and destruction. And American gulags are becoming lucrative ventures for friends of the Republican party as the Yanks imprison more of their citizens than anyone else. Aby Ghraib ? Guantanamo ? Puh, it's nothing compared to the prison industrial complex operating in the USA.


From: Viva La Revolución | Registered: Apr 2004  |  IP: Logged
Kristy
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posted 21 October 2004 08:59 PM      Profile for Kristy     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
That's nothing. Why just today I was at a 7-11 with an Iraqi immigrant who came to America to escape the beatings at the hands of Saddam thugs overcharged me for gas from the oil that comes from his native country. I'm feeling so oppresed right now.

Hey, if you believe The Guardian's point-blank pseudo-journalism propaganda then why not mine?


From: Boulder, Colorado | Registered: Oct 2004  |  IP: Logged
WingNut
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posted 21 October 2004 09:05 PM      Profile for WingNut   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Because the Guardian is a credible news organization and you are just another dime-a-dozen asshole. That's why.
From: Out There | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
Fidel
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posted 21 October 2004 09:07 PM      Profile for Fidel     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Kristy:
That's nothing. Why just today I was at a 7-11 with an Iraqi immigrant who came to America to escape the beatings at the hands of Saddam thugs overcharged me for gas from the oil that comes from his native country. I'm feeling so oppresed right now.

Hey, if you believe The Guardian's point-blank pseudo-journalism propaganda then why not mine?


This from a person living in a country that warehouses more poor people than any other nation in private and taxpayer funded state gulags.

So what happened to the story about Saddam gassing his own people ?. WMD ?. Or what poor excuse are the colonialist-capitalists passing off now for making a grab on the world's second largest proven oil reserves ?.


From: Viva La Revolución | Registered: Apr 2004  |  IP: Logged
shaolin
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posted 21 October 2004 09:13 PM      Profile for shaolin     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
It's sad. One group of prisoners on their way to Guantanamo, chained in a kneeling-prone position on a C-130 flight to Guantanamo, actually chewed through hydraulic lines running somewhere along the floor. It brought the plane down.

Just out of curiosity, where did this come from?


From: Edinburgh | Registered: Jul 2003  |  IP: Logged
Fidel
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posted 21 October 2004 09:46 PM      Profile for Fidel     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Who knows ?. There are so many secrets and stories about camp X-ray Guantanamo that military people end up spilling. From funding death squads throughout Latin America to torturing their former allies in Kabul, the American's certainly don't want anyone knowing what goes on at 'Gitmo' while violating Geneva conventions for torturing POW's... to death.
From: Viva La Revolución | Registered: Apr 2004  |  IP: Logged
shaolin
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posted 21 October 2004 09:54 PM      Profile for shaolin     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I definitely don't need to be lectured about all the nasty things going on in Guatanamo and Abu Gharib - I'm well aware of the atrocities. I'd just like to know where that last tidbit about the plane being b rought down came from (perhaps a link?) as I've never heard anything about it.
From: Edinburgh | Registered: Jul 2003  |  IP: Logged
Hinterland
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posted 21 October 2004 10:09 PM      Profile for Hinterland        Edit/Delete Post
Yeah, Fidel...it's a valid question.
From: Québec/Ontario | Registered: Apr 2003  |  IP: Logged
Kristy
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posted 21 October 2004 10:25 PM      Profile for Kristy     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
"colonialist-capitalists" you say? As opposed to what, racist-socialist (i.e., Canada) who love oil, too?

Look dude, it was sarcasm, okay? Rarely do I take what anybody says on a forum website at face value for it certianly wasn't written that way. And I NEVER take what the Guardian has to say, EVER! You want to take the press at face value be my guest but leave your pseudo-politcal retorts out of my face until you have anysubstantial ground to walk on besides a friggin'keyboard.


From: Boulder, Colorado | Registered: Oct 2004  |  IP: Logged
Hinterland
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posted 21 October 2004 10:29 PM      Profile for Hinterland        Edit/Delete Post
How many drugs are you presently on? And, can I have some?
From: Québec/Ontario | Registered: Apr 2003  |  IP: Logged
shaolin
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posted 21 October 2004 10:37 PM      Profile for shaolin     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
God, I hope she isn't banned! This is just too goddamn funny!
From: Edinburgh | Registered: Jul 2003  |  IP: Logged
WingNut
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posted 21 October 2004 10:38 PM      Profile for WingNut   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by shaolin:
I definitely don't need to be lectured about all the nasty things going on in Guatanamo and Abu Gharib - I'm well aware of the atrocities. I'd just like to know where that last tidbit about the plane being b rought down came from (perhaps a link?) as I've never heard anything about it.

Where did you get it from?


From: Out There | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
WingNut
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posted 21 October 2004 10:41 PM      Profile for WingNut   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
pseudo-politcal retorts

Oh. Tell you what, I will if you keep your pseudo-intellect out of my face. Deal?

From: Out There | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
shaolin
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posted 21 October 2004 10:42 PM      Profile for shaolin     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Wingnut: Are you asking me or Fidel? I'm trying to google for info on a C-130 being brought down due to chewed through hydraulic lines but so far nothing...
From: Edinburgh | Registered: Jul 2003  |  IP: Logged
shaolin
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posted 21 October 2004 10:44 PM      Profile for shaolin     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
racist-socialist (i.e., Canada)

Wow, where have I been! I'd love to hear you expand on this little description, Kristy.

From: Edinburgh | Registered: Jul 2003  |  IP: Logged
Hinterland
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posted 21 October 2004 10:45 PM      Profile for Hinterland        Edit/Delete Post
Shaolin is asking a valid question. Fidel, is this a real event or just something you're throwing in for...colour? It's not unreasonnable to ask this.
From: Québec/Ontario | Registered: Apr 2003  |  IP: Logged
WingNut
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posted 21 October 2004 10:51 PM      Profile for WingNut   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Wingnut: Are you asking me or Fidel? I'm trying to google for info on a C-130 being brought down due to chewed through hydraulic lines but so far nothing...

I was asking you. I had not seen the original comment and assumed you were getting it from a linked article. I see it now.

From: Out There | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
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posted 23 October 2004 12:43 AM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Abu Ghraib abuser jailed for 8 years

quote:
THE highest ranking soldier charged in the Iraqi prison abuse scandal was sentenced to eight years in jail at a US court martial in Baghdad yesterday.

The sentence for Staff Sergeant Ivan Frederick, an Army reservist and military policeman, was the longest yet in connection with the abuse of inmates at Abu Ghraib prison, in Baghdad. Frederick, who pleaded guilty to eight counts of abusing and humiliating Iraqi detainees, acknowledged that he attached wires to a detainee’s hands and told him he would be electrocuted if he fell off a box. He also forced prisoners to masturbate.


Drug dealers get locked up for longer than 8 years, for chrissakes.


From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 23 October 2004 01:12 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
But, don't you see this soldier will now have to face a regimented regieme, where all of his movements will be specifically dictated and he will be ordered to do umpleasant am meanial duties at the behest of his superior officers, and be told how to lead his life down to the minutest detail, such as when he can get up and when he can go to sleep, unlike in the past when he faced a regimented regieme, where all of his movements were specifically dictated and he was ordered to do umpleasant and meanial duties at the behest of his superior officers, and wastold how to lead his life down to the minutest detail, such as when he was to get up and when he was to go to sleep and possibly get killed doing it.
From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Mr. Magoo
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posted 23 October 2004 01:15 AM      Profile for Mr. Magoo   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Maybe they mean 8 years in an Iraqi jail.
From: ø¤°`°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°°¤ø, | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 23 October 2004 01:19 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
*snarf* this guy will see his folks more often when he is in jail stateside.
From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
al-Qa'bong
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posted 23 October 2004 02:47 AM      Profile for al-Qa'bong   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
THE highest ranking soldier charged in the Iraqi prison abuse scandal was sentenced to eight years in jail at a US court martial in Baghdad yesterday.

The sentence for Staff Sergeant Ivan Frederick...


A lowly Staff Sergeant is the highest ranking member to be charged for these atrocities?

The Minister of War, Donald Rumsfeld, sanctioned the torture in Abu Ghraib, and every officer between Rumsfeld and Sgt. Frederick through whom orders were passed is complicit in what went on there.

What a bloody whitewash!


From: Saskatchistan | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged
Mr. Magoo
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posted 23 October 2004 03:05 AM      Profile for Mr. Magoo   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
They should have promoted Lynndie England to General, then court martialed her.
From: ø¤°`°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°°¤ø, | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 23 October 2004 04:23 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
*snerk*
From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
gula
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posted 23 October 2004 02:29 PM      Profile for gula     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by al-Qa'bong:
A lowly Staff Sergeant is the highest ranking member to be charged for these atrocities?

What else did you expect? Hell, they even want to promote Sanchez to a 4 star general.

"Top administration figures are angling to promote Army Lt. Gen. Ricardo Sanchez, who ran detention facilities in Iraq, officials say."

http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/printer_101604I.shtml


From: Montréal | Registered: Jul 2004  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
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posted 23 October 2004 02:43 PM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Maybe one day there'll be the Fallujah trials wherein the top brass of this Administration will actually be forced to serve prison time for their knowledge and official sanction of the Abu Ghraib atrocities.

Oh well. I can dream.


From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 23 October 2004 02:49 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
"Top administration figures are angling to promote Army Lt. Gen. Ricardo Sanchez, who ran detention facilities in Iraq, officials say."


Called being kicked upstairs. Ca't demote him to Colonel, its an admission of guilt. They'll give him a desk job in the Pentagon.


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Fidel
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posted 23 October 2004 03:28 PM      Profile for Fidel     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Hinterland:
Shaolin is asking a valid question. Fidel, is this a real event or just something you're throwing in for...colour? It's not unreasonnable to ask this.

You know, I can't remember where I actually read about the plane or exactly where the prisoners were from, but I do remember reading that the destination was Gitmo. I, too, have tried to find something to backup my comment but can find very little. I had no idea that our in-house KGB would be all over me for it. ha ha So at this point, it's only a half-truth. But the CIA/NSA are masters of half-truths and lies themselves.

quote:
Now, even though there have been objections to the way that these individuals were treated by human rights groups, the fact is, the Pentagon says that it really had no choice. General Richard Myers, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, has said that some of these people are so extreme, so fanatical, that they would literally chew the hydraulic cables apart in the back of a cargo plane simply so it would crash.

C'mon you guys, Camp X-Ray's torture gulag isn't that bad, is it ?. Sun, crafts and occasional beatings ... to death ?. Who really knows about Gitmo? If the good general says says "literally", then who am I to question his integrity ?.

From the USSA's own PentaGONE Dept - CNN transcripts - barf

"You can't handle the truth!." - Colonel Nathan Jessep ha ha

[ 23 October 2004: Message edited by: Fidel ]


From: Viva La Revolución | Registered: Apr 2004  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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posted 23 October 2004 04:03 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
General Richard Myers, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, has said that some of these people are so extreme, so fanatical, that they would literally chew the hydraulic cables apart in the back of a cargo plane simply so it would crash.

So that's where it came from. If I were still capable of laughing, I would laugh.

Fidel, I hope that you've learned your lesson. Never believe an American general.


From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
sgm
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posted 25 October 2004 08:19 PM      Profile for sgm     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I heard Cliff Kindy, a member of a Christian Peacemaker Team in Iraq, speak this weekend about detainees and the work of the CPT in--among other things--documenting cases of detainee abuse. Speaking of Abu Ghraib in particular, he said that what was happening there was considered by many detainees to be milder and more improved treatment than what was being doled out in more remote detention centres.

Here's a link to some of their detainee profiles. You can also find other information on their site on Iraq and on the CPT generally.


From: I have welcomed the dawn from the fields of Saskatchewan | Registered: Apr 2004  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
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posted 25 October 2004 10:29 PM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by sgm:
Speaking of Abu Ghraib in particular, he said that what was happening there was considered by many detainees to be milder and more improved treatment than what was being doled out in more remote detention centres.

"(M)ilder and more improved"?! That should scare the hell out of anyone who thought Abu Ghraib was the be-all-and-end-all of American callousness and inhumanity.

If I had any water to spew, my keyboard would have been covered with it the instant I read that paragraph.

The United States certainly hasn't wasted any time emulating the worst regimes of the 20th century.


From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged

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