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Author Topic: Israel’s image on CIC agenda
Mycroft_
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posted 10 July 2003 03:10 AM      Profile for Mycroft_     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
From the Canadian Jewish News:
quote:

The board of directors of the Canada-Israel Committee (CIC) will meet later this month to consider a comprehensive strategy aimed at improving Israel’s image with the Canadian public.

Although details remain sketchy, the strategy could include creation of a speaker’s bureau, more organized missions to Israel for policy-makers, and other steps that would highlight the shared values of the two democracies.




Here's an idea, how about urging Israel to withdraw from the occupied territories?

quote:

To better gauge the changes that needed to be made in community advocacy efforts, the CIC commissioned a massive research project by GPC International, a government and public relations firm headed by Hershell Ezrin. The polling, which was followed up by several focus group evaluations, took place between October 2002 and May 2003 and examined “the public’s knowledge of Israel and Canadian policy.”

More than 2,000 people were sampled, Fogel said. “There were some disturbing results in terms of the extent to which Canadians don’t identify with Israel,” he said. “To a majority of Canadians, Israel is not viewed as a sister democracy that practices freedom of speech, freedom of the press, freedom of religion – all the touchstones of shared values we talk about. That doesn’t translate down to Joe Canadian. Israel and the Middle East are seen as tent-dwellers, with sand between their toes, banana republics,” he said.



Canadians don't view Israel as a sister democracy? How could that be?
quote:
Without a visceral connection to Israel, Canadians take an even-handed approach to the Mideast conflict and expect their government to do the same. While there is a strong association in the public’s mind between Palestinians and terrorism, Israelis too are associated with random killings, though slightly less than Palestinians, Fogel said.

So the problem isn't that there is a bias against Israel, it's that Canadians take an "even handed approach" !!!!!!

From: Toronto | Registered: Feb 2002  |  IP: Logged
Briguy
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posted 10 July 2003 08:46 AM      Profile for Briguy     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Canadians take an even-handed approach to the Mideast conflict

We're obviously country of vile anti-semites.


From: No one is arguing that we should run the space program based on Physics 101. | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
Smith
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posted 10 July 2003 09:00 AM      Profile for Smith     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
“There were some disturbing results in terms of the extent to which Canadians don’t identify with Israel,” he said.

Oh, boo hoo.

What, we're supposed to share their white man's burden or something?


From: Muddy York | Registered: Oct 2002  |  IP: Logged
al-Qa'bong
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posted 10 July 2003 12:01 PM      Profile for al-Qa'bong   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Israel and the Middle East are seen as tent-dwellers, with sand between their toes, banana republics

Quick, get Dr. Conway quarantined!


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skdadl
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Babbler # 478

posted 10 July 2003 12:12 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Have I ever told you how much I despise NAmerican PR and marketing-think?

Few things disgust me more. I cannot believe these people. Short of Dick Cheney, this is absolutely the most shameful, terrible thing that has happened to Western culture since it was mistakenly transported to this continent.

I blame Walt Disney.


From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
al-Qa'bong
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posted 10 July 2003 12:48 PM      Profile for al-Qa'bong   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I blame Edward Bernays.
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skdadl
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posted 10 July 2003 12:51 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Is he the lateral-thinking guy? I quite enjoyed that stuff.

We should probably be blaming P.T. Barnum: "There's a sucker born every minute." That's the assumption that is at the base (and I do mean base) of all NAmerican PR and marketing thought, no?

They think we're stupid. It is an unavoidable conclusion.


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al-Qa'bong
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posted 10 July 2003 01:01 PM      Profile for al-Qa'bong   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Lateral-thinking? Doesn't sound like Bernays. He was more of a "top-down" fellow.

quote:
If we understand the mechanism and motives of the group mind, it is now possible to control and regiment the masses according to our will without their knowing it.

quote:
The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. ... We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of.

One, among many, google hits


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skdadl
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posted 10 July 2003 01:07 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
How truly dreadful. I must read more of him. But how truly dreadful. Worse than Ayn Rand.

It turns out that I was thinking of Edward de Bono. His games are fun.

That's twice for me today, mixing up phosphorus with potassium and then these two Edwards. Time for lunch.


From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
al-Qa'bong
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posted 10 July 2003 01:48 PM      Profile for al-Qa'bong   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I thought you might have meant Edward de Bono. I recall that I used to thumb through his books before quietly replacing them on bookstore shelves.
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Blind_Patriot
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posted 10 July 2003 02:03 PM      Profile for Blind_Patriot     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
This is ridculous
quote:
More than 2,000 people were sampled, Fogel said. “There were some disturbing results in terms of the extent to which Canadians don’t identify with Israel,” he said. “To a majority of Canadians, Israel is not viewed as a sister democracy that practices freedom of speech, freedom of the press, freedom of religion – all the touchstones of shared values we talk about. That doesn’t translate down to Joe Canadian. Israel and the Middle East are seen as tent-dwellers, with sand between their toes, banana republics,” he said.
There is no Sister democracy in Israel. This is such hyperbole! Arab Israeli's are second class citizens, people are held in jails without trail and they continue to expand settlemenmts and infringe a people sovreignty. What a load of rotton pig shit.

From: North Of The Authoritarian Regime | Registered: Mar 2003  |  IP: Logged
April Follies
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posted 10 July 2003 02:36 PM      Profile for April Follies   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
The current administrations in the US and Israel both seem to suffer under the illusion that if they just had better PR, everyone would be OK with them. The thought of actually changing the substance, rather than the style, of their actions doesn't seem to occur. They really don't have much respect for the intelligence of the world's people, do they?
From: Help, I'm stuck in the USA | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
josh
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posted 10 July 2003 02:59 PM      Profile for josh     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Everthing is PR today. It's the world's most important industry.
From: the twilight zone between the U.S. and Canada | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
Courage
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posted 10 July 2003 03:06 PM      Profile for Courage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by skdadl:
Is he the lateral-thinking guy? I quite enjoyed that stuff.

We should probably be blaming P.T. Barnum: "There's a sucker born every minute." That's the assumption that is at the base (and I do mean base) of all NAmerican PR and marketing thought, no?

They think we're stupid. It is an unavoidable conclusion.


Skdadl + al: There is another thing we can't forget - the shift to 'telepresence' through the expansion of electronic media technology coverage. When most people's information about the world they believe themselves to be living in is coming from the flashing box and the radio, there is a distinct problem of mediation. No longer are my immediate sensory experiences of phenomena my prime gauge of their meaning. 'Tele-meaning' comes from how facts are framed and narrated - in short, how they are (re)presented. This moment of mediation leaves a space open to 'create meaning' where there was none before. I'm rambling a bit, but do you see my point?


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Blind_Patriot
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posted 10 July 2003 03:06 PM      Profile for Blind_Patriot     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
This whole marketing thing is crazy. I don't think that people are anti-semetic, rather they are critical of Israel's human rights violations and somewhat apartheid system. I'm sure I can reflect most Canadians point of view when it comes to drawing their own conclusions to the crisis. Our media is less bias in Israel's benefit than our American counterparts. How will they accomplish this brainwashing adgenda to make Isreal the Snow White of the Middle East? Because in cartoons, you can write your own story and anything is possible.
From: North Of The Authoritarian Regime | Registered: Mar 2003  |  IP: Logged
Courage
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posted 10 July 2003 03:08 PM      Profile for Courage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
More than 2,000 people were sampled, Fogel said. “There were some disturbing results in terms of the extent to which Canadians don’t identify with Israel,” he said. “To a majority of Canadians, Israel is not viewed as a sister democracy that practices freedom of speech, freedom of the press, freedom of religion – all the touchstones of shared values we talk about. That doesn’t translate down to Joe Canadian. Israel and the Middle East are seen as tent-dwellers, with sand between their toes, banana republics,” he said.

Note that these 'talking points' are a prime feature in the arguments of many 'pro-Israel' voices in the media, on the internet, BBs, etc. One often finds that there is a 'wave', a kind of offensive on a particular theme that will spread across various media at once. It's no coincidence.

Take the site linked to by Mishei the other day - the U.S.-Israel people. This kind of thing is their primary, stated, business. For better or worse kids, it's all advertising now...

[ 10 July 2003: Message edited by: Courage ]


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Smith
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posted 10 July 2003 03:17 PM      Profile for Smith     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Canada has built up around itself the notion that it is a welcoming, egalitarian, "multi-cultural" society.

Israel, although it may statistically be more multi-cultural/multi-racial than Canada, devotes large amounts of time to making sure that it does not become an egalitarian, multi-cultural society.

If Israel wants to be recognized as a "sister democracy" to Canada, maybe it should start acting like one.


From: Muddy York | Registered: Oct 2002  |  IP: Logged
Courage
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posted 10 July 2003 03:18 PM      Profile for Courage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Blind_Patriot:
This whole marketing thing is crazy. I don't think that people are anti-semetic, rather they are critical of Israel's human rights violations and somewhat apartheid system. I'm sure I can reflect most Canadians point of view when it comes to drawing their own conclusions to the crisis. Our media is less bias in Israel's benefit than our American counterparts. How will they accomplish this brainwashing adgenda to make Isreal the Snow White of the Middle East? Because in cartoons, you can write your own story and anything is possible.


I've been toying with the idea of 'politicide' as presented by Baruch Kimmerling. In essence, it's the denial of a group's economic, social, and cultural agency. In an era when images create our perceptive reality, the effort to control the 'image' of the Palestinians that the rest of the world sees is the 'extermination' of an tele-abstracted world. No longer is it necessary to strictly exterminate the Palestinians in 'body' to crush them and render them out of the picture. One now must only control how they are 'seen', how their image is represented, and the job is then merely to contain them in this state. Out with the old-school extermination of the problematic ethnic group and their claim, in with the 'extermination' of their image as full humans, as political, economic, and social agents.


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Blind_Patriot
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posted 10 July 2003 05:02 PM      Profile for Blind_Patriot     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Courage:


I've been toying with the idea of 'politicide' as presented by Baruch Kimmerling. In essence, it's the denial of a group's economic, social, and cultural agency. In an era when images create our perceptive reality, the effort to control the 'image' of the Palestinians that the rest of the world sees is the 'extermination' of an tele-abstracted world. No longer is it necessary to strictly exterminate the Palestinians in 'body' to crush them and render them out of the picture. One now must only control how they are 'seen', how their image is represented, and the job is then merely to contain them in this state. Out with the old-school extermination of the problematic ethnic group and their claim, in with the 'extermination' of their image as full humans, as political, economic, and social agents.


Read Reviews

Here


From: North Of The Authoritarian Regime | Registered: Mar 2003  |  IP: Logged
lagatta
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posted 10 July 2003 05:35 PM      Profile for lagatta     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Don't know about "sister democracies" but important to keep in mind that even democracies have treated their indigenous populations in a foul manner.

It is spin. There are still anti-semites out there, but this campaign isn't fighting them, it is trying to whitewash the occupation.


From: Se non ora, quando? | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
Smith
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posted 10 July 2003 05:47 PM      Profile for Smith     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Don't know about "sister democracies" but important to keep in mind that even democracies have treated their indigenous populations in a foul manner.

This is absolutely true. However, democracies like the US and Canada have stopped expanding and have tried (however inadequately) to make some restitution.

I forget where I read it, but I think there's a lot of truth in the statement that the state of Israel has a huge PR problem because it was founded in a time when colonialism was seen (by the powers that be, obviously, not the indigenous populations) as a bad thing, as opposed to the US, Canada, etc., which were put together when colonialism was generally portrayed in a more favourable light.


From: Muddy York | Registered: Oct 2002  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
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posted 10 July 2003 06:00 PM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by al-Qa'bong:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Israel and the Middle East are seen as tent-dwellers, with sand between their toes, banana republics
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quick, get Dr. Conway quarantined!


Heehee. I wonder if those people read babble. Iran won't qualify as a banana republic but Syria might well qualify, incidentally, given that political dissent is frowned upon and the leader, Bashar Assad, has no qualifications for the job other than his dad used to have it. Kind of like Dubya Bush, ironically.


From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Courage
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posted 10 July 2003 11:50 PM      Profile for Courage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Blind_Patriot:
Read Reviews

Here


Just to clarify and blow my own horn (or make myself look stupid depending on how you see my argument) the 'politicide' business is Kimmerling's neologism. The definition is the destruction of an ethnic/national group's social, political and economic agency.

My thoughts about what extermination might mean in a virtual 'telepresent' disembodied reality like that we function in more and more is me trying to blend Kimmerling and Paul Virilio - or more precisely, read 'politicide' in the light of Virilio's positions on how electronic media effect our perceptions and drive certain political/social behaviours. For those who aren't familiar with Virilio, he is the author of some fantastic books on media, technology and the 'architecture' of war (he might agree that these are all one thing or at least closely intertwined, in fact) - e.g. Open Sky, Ground Zero (a pamphlette on 9/11) and my personal favorite, The Information Bomb.

I say this mostly to ensure there is no confusion about the content of Kimmerling's book. It is a well argued, well evinced history of the 'politicide' of the Palestinians by the Israeli state. He doesn't get into the media theory that I tried to.

[ 11 July 2003: Message edited by: Courage ]


From: Earth | Registered: Apr 2003  |  IP: Logged

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