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Author Topic: On the right path
Mishei
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Babbler # 2785

posted 08 June 2003 01:17 AM      Profile for Mishei     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Let's try to look at this as though the glass is half full. I think this is an excellent editorial from Israel's most important left of centre newspaper, Ha'aretz:

On the right path

quote:
According to Knesset Speaker Reuven Rivlin, one of
the closest politicians to Sharon (see Ha'aretz
Magazine, June 5), this is no trickery on the
part of the prime minister, nor an attempt to
appease President George Bush. Rivlin revealed
that Sharon has come to terms with the need to
separate from 3.5 million Palestinians in the
territories, even if this arrangement may force
Israel to abandon 16 or 17 settlements in the
heart of the West Bank. In view of the raucous
response of members of Likud and the extreme
right, and the sounds of fury emanating from the
settlers who were nurtured by Sharon, the brunt
of heavy responsibility carried on the shoulders
of an Israeli prime minister has actually led
Sharon to adopt the essence of reconciliation and
compromise.

[ 08 June 2003: Message edited by: Mishei ]

[ 08 June 2003: Message edited by: Mishei ]


From: Toronto | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
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posted 08 June 2003 01:21 AM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Well, then, if anyone is a religious person, I say "lettuce pray".

For my part I shall hope that Sharon has learned that the definition of stupidity is doing the same thing multiple times and getting a different result than the one you keep expecting.


From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
al-Qa'bong
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posted 08 June 2003 04:13 AM      Profile for al-Qa'bong   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Is something missing from that Ha'aretz article?

"Even if this arrangement may force Israel to abandon 16 or 17 settlements in the heart of the West Bank"?

There are 190 settlements in the West Bank.

How can giving up 16 or 17 settlements solve anything? There must be more to this.


From: Saskatchistan | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged
josh
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posted 08 June 2003 09:00 AM      Profile for josh     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Thank you al-Qabong for bringing some perspective. People are just deluding themselves by believing that Sharon will agree to a contiguous Palestinian state and to give up East Jersusalem.
From: the twilight zone between the U.S. and Canada | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
Mishei
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posted 08 June 2003 04:04 PM      Profile for Mishei     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
For my part I shall hope that Sharon has learned that the definition of stupidity is doing the same thing multiple times and getting a different result than the one you keep expecting.


Surely you must have meant Arafat!!??

From: Toronto | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged
Mishei
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posted 08 June 2003 04:05 PM      Profile for Mishei     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by josh:
Thank you al-Qabong for bringing some perspective. People are just deluding themselves by believing that Sharon will agree to a contiguous Palestinian state and to give up East Jersusalem.
Yes yes Josh, sheesh you will soon be known as Mr. Negativity.

From: Toronto | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
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posted 08 June 2003 04:08 PM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Well, it's true. I thought the "16 or 17" number was a little too low. You can't really believe that giving up a piddly number of settlements equates to a true transfer of sovereignty from Israel to the PA.
From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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posted 08 June 2003 04:08 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Well, but, Mishei: Can you explain the discrepancy between those numbers? Why would Ha'aretz be so pleased with the eventual dismantling of so few of those settlements?
From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Mishei
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posted 08 June 2003 04:27 PM      Profile for Mishei     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Skdadl, my best guess is that they are referring to the 16 or 17 that are in question. There are a large number in Gaza and elsewhere (as per the late Taba agreement) that can be dismantled. As well where there have been some areas on the near outskirts of jerusalem settled for over 35 years there may be (again as per Taba) some land exchange...so it is far more complicated then we may imagine nonetheless I pray there are people of goodwwill on both sides willing to compromise for peace.

Ha'aretz is vey good at responding to these questions. Feel free to email them. It is a very progressive paper usually frowned on by the Israeli right.


From: Toronto | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged
al-Qa'bong
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posted 08 June 2003 07:15 PM      Profile for al-Qa'bong   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
From the Ha'aretz article:

quote:

Ariel Sharon is a wise and experienced leader, who
is pressed by party considerations a lot less
than any of his predecessors. He does not need
lessons in morality from the radicals in his
camp, and he should not be deterred by the
churlish calls rising from the courts of rabbis
and extreme nationalists.

It seems as if Ha'aretz doesn't exactly frown on the Israeli right though.


From: Saskatchistan | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged
Mishei
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posted 08 June 2003 07:24 PM      Profile for Mishei     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by al-Qa'bong:
From the Ha'aretz article:

It seems as if Ha'aretz doesn't exactly frown on the Israeli right though.



Then you do not read Ha'aretz. Al I thought better of you...you make a generalization over an entire newspaper through one editorial? Anyone who has read Ha'aretz knows it is a leftist oriented paper and well respected to boot.

From: Toronto | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged
al-Qa'bong
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posted 08 June 2003 07:35 PM      Profile for al-Qa'bong   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Al I thought better of you

Roll your condescension up in a copy of Ha'aretz and stick it somewhere, Mish.


From: Saskatchistan | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged
Mishei
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Babbler # 2785

posted 08 June 2003 08:41 PM      Profile for Mishei     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by al-Qa'bong:

Roll your condescension up in a copy of Ha'aretz and stick it somewhere, Mish.


Come to think of it I have the perfect place to stick it,


From: Toronto | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged
Courage
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posted 09 June 2003 04:42 PM      Profile for Courage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Mishei:
Come to think of it I have the perfect place to stick it,



Either end, they both produce the same substance...


From: Earth | Registered: Apr 2003  |  IP: Logged
josh
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posted 09 June 2003 05:12 PM      Profile for josh     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Actually, while Haaretz is generally very good when it comes to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, it takes an neo-liberal position when it comes to economic policies. That's reflected not only in the editorials, but in the op-eds by the likes of Messrs Tal and Strasler. There is little voice given to the other side.

So, to say that Haaretz is a "left" paper is somewhat of a simplification.


From: the twilight zone between the U.S. and Canada | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
Mishei
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Babbler # 2785

posted 09 June 2003 07:34 PM      Profile for Mishei     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Courage:


Either end, they both produce the same substance...


I don't think we need further discuss your bodily functions here on Babble.



From: Toronto | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
Moderator
Babbler # 560

posted 09 June 2003 07:37 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I'm away for a few days, and look what happens. Body orifices galore.

Back on topic! *thwack*


From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
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Babbler # 490

posted 09 June 2003 11:56 PM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by josh:
Actually, while Haaretz is generally very good when it comes to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, it takes an neo-liberal position when it comes to economic policies. That's reflected not only in the editorials, but in the op-eds by the likes of Messrs Tal and Strasler. There is little voice given to the other side.

So, to say that Haaretz is a "left" paper is somewhat of a simplification.


They did go quite easily on Netanyahu, did they not?

Speaking of which I should remember to check the quarterly update on the Israeli budget...


From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
josh
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posted 10 June 2003 10:23 AM      Profile for josh     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Yes, Mr. Netanyahoo is having quite a time as finance minister. He's trying to channel Reagan and Thatcher by being tough on the unions at the same time he pushes for further privatization.
From: the twilight zone between the U.S. and Canada | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged

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