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Author Topic: Liberal posts racist slur on Chow - Part II
Hephaestion
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Babbler # 4795

posted 27 December 2005 01:19 AM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
Continued from this thread


It might seem like this is a dead issue, now, but I'd like to keep a thread going for another day or two if possible, just to track what kind of coverage (or non-coverage) this gets in the media.

I heard a "blurb" about 10 seconds long on CBC Radio earlier... wow! You folks get the Gnashional before me -- did it even rate a mention?

For a change I have some sympathies for the Reformatories, as vile as they are. Can you imagine the denunciations, the finger-pointing, the histrionics that would have gripped CBC if this had been a Reformatory big-wig that did this? Gawd, our "public broadcaster" makes me peeee-yook sometimes...


From: goodbye... :-( | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Hunky_Monkey
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Babbler # 6081

posted 27 December 2005 01:26 AM      Profile for Hunky_Monkey     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Hephaestion:
Continued from this thread

It might seem like this is a dead issue, now, but I'd like to keep a thread going for another day or two if possible, just to track what kind of coverage (or non-coverage) this gets in the media.

I heard a "blurb" about 10 seconds long on CBC Radio earlier... wow! You folks get the Gnashional before me -- did it even rate a mention?

For a change I have some sympathies for the Reformatories, as vile as they are. Can you imagine the denunciations, the finger-pointing, the histrionics that would have gripped CBC if this had been a Reformatory big-wig that did this? Gawd, our "public broadcaster" makes me peeee-yook sometimes...


Paul Wells is right... if this was the Executive Vice-President (Ontario) of the Conservative Party of Canada, the Liberals would be having a field day...

quote:
Which blood vessels would Susan Murray and John Duffy be popping if they'd discovered a Conservative moron comparing an Asian-Canadian candidate to a dog?

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Privateer
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Babbler # 3446

posted 27 December 2005 01:43 AM      Profile for Privateer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Here's a story from the CBC website.

quote:
Stephen Heckbert, a spokesman for the Liberal campaign in Ontario, said Klander's blog was a personal one that did not reflect the view of the federal party.

He called the material "outside the bounds of good taste" and said Klander had apologized to Chow.

"Obviously, this is something the Liberal Party of Canada doesn't condone," Heckbert told the Canadian Press.

"It's our view that partisan rhetoric has its limits."



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TheStudent
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Babbler # 11410

posted 27 December 2005 02:18 AM      Profile for TheStudent        Edit/Delete Post
The fact that the LPC would view this as over-the-top campaign rhetoric says something, more that what was said by Klander, about their true view of people of non-European heritage. The LPC, if they had any intention of backing up their rhetoric on the Charter, would be coming down on Klander with, for lack of a better phrase, the wrath of an angered deity. This is the kind of thing, if it could get publicity, that would level the degree of scary factor between the LPC and CPC.
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Albireo
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posted 27 December 2005 02:21 AM      Profile for Albireo     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I agree that there would be a much larger shitstorm if this were done by a Conservtive. The relative lack of outcry really shows that the Liberals get a fairly easy ride.
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Vansterdam Kid
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posted 27 December 2005 02:25 AM      Profile for Vansterdam Kid   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
SGM pointed this out earlier, but I think it bears repeating. The NDP really needs to highlight the hypocracy of this claim, and get Paul Martin to apologize and address the issue. As it's clear the Liberals, and unfortunatley the CBC too, just want to minimize this:

[cp]

quote:
Klander was a volunteer and did not play an official role for the Liberals during this campaign, Heckbert said, adding he's apologized to Chow.

When as Paul Wells points out:

quote:
CP is quoting a long-suffering Liberal spokesman to the effect that Klander was "a volunteer" who had no official role in the current campaign. This rather understates the guy's significance. He delivered Tony Dionisio to the Martin camp in '02, and together, they delivered Ontario. When Sheila Copps got uppity, Klander was dispatched to take proper care of her in Hamilton in '04. I fondly recall the first place I ever saw the guy: in the union-hall basement where Paul Martin announced to a breathless world in 2002 that he wasn't sure he could work with Jean Chrétien any more. That whole event was a Klander/Dionisio special. But they were just volunteers, you understand.

link

The NDP needs to ask Paul Martin to directly apologize for or dissavow Mike Klander, who was a key organizer on behalf of his leadership bid. For us BC babblers, it would be like if Mark Marrissen made a similar comment and then the Liberals just said he was a minor volunteer. So it simply doesn't fly that the Liberals are trying to claim he was simply a volunteer, even if he didn't get paid (which would be rich), clearly his position indicates how important he was to Martin himself.


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Hephaestion
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posted 27 December 2005 03:31 AM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
To answer my own question from earlier, no, not a hint of a breath of a word about this on The Gnashional. Thank goodness for the anniversary of a natural disaster that killed hundreds of thousands half-way around the world a year ago. Between that, and the shooting in Toronto today, gosh, there was just no room for any other news. (Oh, please forget that the last six minutes or so of the newscast was taken up by the gripping story of a Winnipeg family that tries to fit as many family members as possible on a toboggan)...

And as for:

quote:
When Sheila Copps got uppity, Klander was dispatched to take proper care of her in Hamilton in '04.


Well, I guess Sheila's prolly having a giggle or two today...

[ 27 December 2005: Message edited by: Hephaestion ]


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TheStudent
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posted 27 December 2005 03:56 AM      Profile for TheStudent        Edit/Delete Post
This just in: Klander resigns.

This was on CBC.ca:

A prominent member of the federal Liberal Party resigned Monday over comments he made on his blog about NDP Leader Jack Layton and his wife, NDP candidate Olivia Chow.

Mike Klander, a public affairs consultant in Toronto, had been executive vice-president of the party's Ontario wing.

He stepped down from the volunteer position after it was revealed that he had posted a picture of Chow on his personal blog alongside a picture of a chow chow dog, with the heading "Separated at birth."

Chow is running as the NDP candidate for the Toronto riding of Trinity-Spadina.

The blog, which has been taken offline, also contained nasty comments about Layton.

In an entry dated Nov. 23, he wrote: "I'm going away for a couple of days so I thought I would find something smart and witty to put up on my blog before I left. Unfortunately I couldn't think of anything so I just want to say that I think Jack Layton is an a**hole ... for no reason other than it makes me feel good to say it ... and because he is."

Stephen Heckbert, a spokesman for the Liberal campaign in Ontario, said Klander's blog was a personal one that did not reflect the view of the federal party.

He called the material "outside the bounds of good taste" and said Klander had apologized to Chow.

"Obviously, this is something the Liberal Party of Canada doesn't condone," Heckbert told the Canadian Press.

"It's our view that partisan rhetoric has its limits."

Good riddance to bad rubbish.


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Hephaestion
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posted 27 December 2005 05:41 AM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
Well, here's the latest round-up, courtesy of google news (I edited out duplicates):


quote:
Liberal quits after blog maligns Layton, wife

London Free Press, Canada - 2 hours ago

... Mike Klander, executive vice-president of the federal Liberal party's Ontario wing, stepped down after photographs of Chow, the NDP candidate for the Toronto ...


quote:
Liberal exec resigns after blog controversy

Toronto Star, Canada - 7 hours ago

Mike Klander, executive vice-president of the federal Liberal party's Ontario wing, stepped down after photographs of Chow, the NDP candidate for the Toronto


quote:
Harper Hopes Negative Campaign Backfires on Liberals

580 CFRA Radio, Canada - 1 hour ago

... described Harper as "creepy.". Mike Klander stepped down after word of his Internet blog leaked out. Harper says it's a campaign


quote:
Blog bombshell hits Grits

Ottawa Sun, Canada - 10 minutes ago

... Mike Klander, executive vice-president of the federal Liberal party's Ontario wing, stepped down after photographs of Chow, the NDP candidate for the Toronto


quote:
Liberal executive resigns after disparaging NDP politicians on ...

CBC News, Canada - 46 minutes ago

... Chow. Mike Klander, a public affairs consultant in Toronto, had been executive vice-president of the party's Ontario wing. He stepped


quote:
Liberal resigns after posting insults on blog

CTV.ca, Canada - 5 hours ago

Mike Klander, executive vice-president of the federal Liberal party's Ontario wing, stepped down after photographs of Chow, the NDP candidate for the Toronto


quote:
Federal Liberal party official quits over NDP blog remarks

Hamilton Spectator (subscription), Canada - 2 hours ago

Mike Klander, executive vice-president of the federal Liberal party's Ontario wing, resigned yesterday after he compared Chow to a dog and called Layton an


quote:
Liberal exec resigns after comparing NDP's Olivia Chow to a dog on

Macleans, Canada - 2 hours ago

Mike Klander, executive vice-president of the federal Liberal party's Ontario wing, stepped down after photographs of Chow, NDP candidate for the Toronto


quote:
Liberal exec resigns after comparing NDP's Olivia Chow to a dog on ...

940 News, Canada - 4 hours ago

Mike Klander, executive vice-president of the federal Liberal party's Ontario wing, stepped down after photographs of Chow, NDP candidate for the Toronto


quote:
Liberal exec resigns after comparing NDP's Olivia Chow to a dog on ..

Brooks Bulletin, Canada - 7 hours ago

Mike Klander, executive vice-president of the federal Liberal party's Ontario wing, stepped down after photographs of Chow, the NDP candidate for the Toronto ...


quote:
Liberal resigns after posting insults on blog

CTV.com, Canada - 7 hours ago

Mike Klander, executive vice-president of the federal Liberal party's Ontario wing, stepped down after photographs of Chow, the NDP candidate for the Toronto ...


quote:
Liberal exec resigns after comparing NDP's Olivia Chow to a dog on ...

Brandon Sun, Canada - 8 hours ago

Mike Klander, executive vice-president of the federal Liberal party's Ontario wing, stepped down after photographs of Chow, the NDP candidate for the Toronto ...


quote:
Liberal exec resigns after blog comment

Canoe.ca, Canada - 10 hours ago

Mike Klander, executive vice-president of the federal Liberal party's Ontario wing, resigned today after he compared Chow to a dog and called Layton an "asshole

[ 27 December 2005: Message edited by: Hephaestion ]


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rinne
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posted 27 December 2005 06:39 AM      Profile for rinne     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post

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frumious
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posted 27 December 2005 08:09 AM      Profile for frumious     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I am glad he has resigned, but would rather have seen him fired for his incredibly offensive blog posts. After generally supporting Liberals for 20 years, at least in principle, this was the final straw for me.
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skdadl
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posted 27 December 2005 08:18 AM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Front page of the Grope this a.m.
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nevermind
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posted 27 December 2005 08:25 AM      Profile for nevermind     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
resigned is often a polite way of saying fired....thank God this guys reign as a politico and perhaps as a sleazy lobbyist ( he work for big tabacco, which IMHO is far worse than what he did to Ms. Chow) it is absolutely silly to paint this guy as a typical Grit...there is a idiots, and even racists in all parties..(including the NDP, there was a guy earlier in the camapaign who bought the rights to several police type names in Canada and had them linked to NDP sites...duh not racist but moronic...and the party didn't even pressure him to take down)...
Perhaps the lesson is this is there is enough nasty in the Tories open agenda...we don't have to look for their hidden idiots...any more than we need to look for the Grits hidden agenda..

[ 27 December 2005: Message edited by: nevermind ]


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Stockholm
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posted 27 December 2005 08:48 AM      Profile for Stockholm     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
DING DONG THE WITCH IS DEAD!
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nevermind
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posted 27 December 2005 10:18 AM      Profile for nevermind     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
though folks might get a chuckle out of the irony...here is how "the asshole" describes his company on his website

Mike Klander is a highly specialized and well respected government relations consultant assisting clients both at Queen’s Park in Ontario and at the Federal Government level in Ottawa.

Whether managing a crisis, proposing a new initiative, monitoring legislation, or simply building political relationships, Klander and Associates can help your business or association navigate through government decision making


His client include Imperial Tabacco...makes him a death pimp...too bad he didn't use his sick disparging sense of humor on those death merchants...good news is another sleazy Liberal political shit bites the dust....hahahah...now he can earn a living like the rest of us....

(I guess a PR gig at the Chow lovers club of Canada is out of the question for him)

BTW just in case anyone wants to comment personally to him about his sense of humor he kindly included his address and phone number on his website it is:

Mike Klander
7 Howland Road
Toronto, Onatrio
M4K 274
Canada

Phone: (416) 214-3258
Fax: (416) 214-1576

Email

[ 27 December 2005: Message edited by: nevermind ]


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stem cell
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posted 27 December 2005 11:21 AM      Profile for stem cell        Edit/Delete Post
About as wide a gap as you can get between power and stupidity. Might lose them the election.
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quelar
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posted 27 December 2005 01:03 PM      Profile for quelar     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I'm still stunned here. How did he think this was going to go well for him?

Are we really being ruled by people this stupid?


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Debra
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posted 27 December 2005 01:14 PM      Profile for Debra   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by quelar:
I'm still stunned here. How did he think this was going to go well for him?

Are we really being ruled by people this stupid?


Yes.


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Albireo
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posted 27 December 2005 01:15 PM      Profile for Albireo     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Mike Klander is a highly specialized and well respected government relations consultant assisting clients both at Queen’s Park in Ontario and at the Federal Government level in Ottawa.
In other words: Liberal party insider sells influence on Liberal governments, both federal and provincial. The same kind of crap that happened all the time under the Harris Conservatives.

From: --> . <-- | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
writer
editor emeritus
Babbler # 2513

posted 27 December 2005 01:20 PM      Profile for writer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Posted this in a thread about Sheila Copps last week. Thought it might add another dimension here (the bold is mine):

quote:
It was evident to me, the minute I set foot in the place, that the fix was in. So here's the exchange I had with the Martin factotum, who we will call Mike.

He: "Hi, Warren."

Me: "Hi, Mike."

He: "Nice to see you here."

Me: "Yeah, I bet."

He: "What do you think?"

Me: "I think you are about to fuck over a woman who has been part of the heart and soul of the Liberal Party for twenty years. I think you ought to be ashamed of yourselves."

warrenkinsella.com
December 21, 2005


Does Mike + Mike = Mike?


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Hephaestion
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posted 27 December 2005 01:27 PM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by writer:

Does Mike + Mike = Mike?



From Paul Wells' column (quoted upthread):

quote:
When Sheila Copps got uppity, Klander was dispatched to take proper care of her in Hamilton in '04.


So I'd say, yes.

From: goodbye... :-( | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
writer
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posted 27 December 2005 01:28 PM      Profile for writer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I'd noticed that too, H. I suspect we'll be hearing more from Kinsella about this when he returns to blogging.
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Michelle
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posted 27 December 2005 01:29 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I really hate to say it, but as much as I'd love to see the Liberals go down over this - I'm betting it will be all but forgotten by election day. I agree with those who say that the Liberals get an easy ride on this sort of thing. Also, this guy isn't actually a candidate in the election and therefore doesn't have any face or name recognition, and there are four weeks until election day for all sorts of new stuff to come up. We hardcore politics-watchers will remember it, but Joe Public? Doubt it.

Unfortunately.


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nevermind
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posted 27 December 2005 01:31 PM      Profile for nevermind     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Albireo:
In other words: Liberal party insider sells influence on Liberal governments, both federal and provincial. The same kind of crap that happened all the time under the Harris Conservatives.

further translated into English....Canada's official version of paying off a ruling party member to get you (or your company's) way..


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Screaming Lord Byron
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posted 27 December 2005 01:34 PM      Profile for Screaming Lord Byron     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I think Kinsella may very well have the serious dirt on this one. If anything, this is his moment.
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rinne
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posted 27 December 2005 01:36 PM      Profile for rinne     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
It is interesting to note how willing the Liberals were to drop him. Do they want to distance themselves as much as possible before anyone takes a thorough look at Mike Klander? Is it possible "conflict of interest" was tossed around?

[ 27 December 2005: Message edited by: a citizen of winnipeg ]


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Hephaestion
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posted 27 December 2005 01:40 PM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Screaming Lord Byron:

I think Kinsella may very well have the serious dirt on this one. If anything, this is his moment.


So in the newsroom vernacular... this might have "legs".

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Screaming Lord Byron
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posted 27 December 2005 01:42 PM      Profile for Screaming Lord Byron     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Hephaestion:

So in the newsroom vernacular... this might have "legs".


Simple mathematics, my dear Hephaestion.
The possibility of damage to the Martin camp x Warren Kinsella's (understandable) loathing for said camp x his contacts and past experiences = dirt. Big dirty, mucky dirt.

Watch his blog. He'll have something good for us, I'll bet.

[ 27 December 2005: Message edited by: Screaming Lord Byron ]


From: Calgary | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Hephaestion
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posted 27 December 2005 01:59 PM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
Hee, hee, hee... what was that old line about Hoover? "It's better to have him inside the tent pissing out, than to have him outside pissing in..."

I'm developing a whole new appreciation for Warren Kinsella.

From: goodbye... :-( | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
writer
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posted 27 December 2005 02:05 PM      Profile for writer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Kinsella:
quote:
I, like Sheila, am providing advice to people I like - in whatever party they belong to. Liberals, Tories, New Democrats, Green candidates. I, like Sheila, know the best thing that could happen to the Liberal Party of Canada is a loss - and, as soon as possible thereafter, the departure of Paul Martin and his coterie of well-paid thugs.

Some houses can be renovated, some houses you need to tear down and start over. This one is a tear-down.


Where is that sledgehammer?


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Michelle
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posted 27 December 2005 02:07 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Kinsella has been a not-so-guilty pleasure of mine for a while. Sure, I don't always agree with him, but he's never boring. I like Chretien and Copps a lot more than I like Martin and the Martinites as well, and I find myself agreeing with him on a lot of stuff he writes.

Did you see his post about Layton from December 21? He's right.


From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Screaming Lord Byron
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posted 27 December 2005 02:15 PM      Profile for Screaming Lord Byron     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Yup - his instincts are pretty good, usually.

I read his blog quite a bit - he's obviously a bit of an egotist (although, that's probably a requisite for a blog, right?), and I did consider him a little over-zealous and slightly paranoid over the Liberal Civil War.

Now - not so much.


From: Calgary | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Hephaestion
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posted 27 December 2005 02:54 PM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Michelle:

Did you see his post about Layton from December 21? He's right.



[whine] Awwwww, are ya gonna make us go look? What's it saaaaay? [/whine]

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Albireo
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posted 27 December 2005 03:10 PM      Profile for Albireo     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
It says that Jack is damned smart: look at this (the part beginning with "As for Jack Layton..."). Of course, Kinsella mainly likes it because Layton was using praise of Chretien to bash Martin.

[ 27 December 2005: Message edited by: Albireo ]


From: --> . <-- | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
writer
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posted 27 December 2005 06:57 PM      Profile for writer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Can we imagine this kind of attack happening to the other leaders' wives? Would it have happened to this candidate if she *weren't* married to the person she's married to?

What would the press do if Sheila, Laureen or Yolande had been viciously attacked like this by someone enjoying Mike Klander's position in another party? Is it fair game because Olivia's had the audacity to want an equal political voice, rather than play an appropriate quiet feminine role behind the scenes as "the leader's wife"?

Is the attitude that she's getting what she's asked for? Why is politics such an ugly, ugly game, attracting ugly backroom players like this? Is this really how we get people engaged in democracy? Or is it how we keep it restricted to those who can play mean and smeary. To those who don't have anything cheap and obvious to attack - like being a person of colour, a person with a disability, or gay, or lesbian, or trans, or a woman of any description?

I think, as the implications of this thing sink in, that the story definitely has legs.


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Tory Spelling
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posted 27 December 2005 07:02 PM      Profile for Tory Spelling   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
Let the smears and slurs racial and otherwise by the Liberal party continue. Each one is another nail in their coffin. When you have rats cornered the only thing they know how to do is lash out. Bye Bye Lieberals.
From: Beverly Hills | Registered: Oct 2005  |  IP: Logged
No Yards
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posted 27 December 2005 08:04 PM      Profile for No Yards   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Tory Spelling:
Let the smears and slurs racial and otherwise by the Liberal party continue. Each one is another nail in their coffin. When you have rats cornered the only thing they know how to do is lash out. Bye Bye Lieberals.

Says a long time member of the original racial slur rat party.


From: Defending traditional marriage since June 28, 2005 | Registered: Jun 2003  |  IP: Logged
alao
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posted 27 December 2005 09:32 PM      Profile for alao        Edit/Delete Post
The Liberals are the hypocrites, pure and simple. They claim they have the most tolerant, racially diverse, generous tent of all people, yet this racial slur is just another example that they are no different from any other corrupt party in power for too long...i.e. that they have losers and intolerant and racist types as well...just like the conservatives that they so love to accuse...If only Canadians, and Ontarians, especially, would come to see and admit the Liberals for who they really are: tired, corrupt, washed-out, and willing to say and do anything to stay in power.
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Ken Burch
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posted 27 December 2005 10:18 PM      Profile for Ken Burch     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Tory Spelling:
Let the smears and slurs racial and otherwise by the Liberal party continue. Each one is another nail in their coffin. When you have rats cornered the only thing they know how to do is lash out. Bye Bye Lieberals.

...actually, Tory, in this case that would most likely be Bye Bye Lieberals, hello New Democrats.
Hope you enjoy seeing YOUR party get the same number of seats as last time.

...or, perhaps, fewer...


From: A seedy truckstop on the Information Superhighway | Registered: Feb 2005  |  IP: Logged
Vansterdam Kid
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posted 28 December 2005 02:47 AM      Profile for Vansterdam Kid   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I'm usually not into the Word posts, but Alao, Writer, Debra...Word.
From: bleh.... | Registered: Apr 2004  |  IP: Logged
Hephaestion
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4795

posted 28 December 2005 05:29 AM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
Wow... babble can't get enough of this topic -- someone has started up a third thread over here.

Anyway, just thought I'd mention that for the second night running, The Gnashional had almost two-thirds of its alloted time span taken up with "tsunami nostalgia", as well as stories on rain in BC, and traditional hand-made "nesting" Russian dolls... but nary a whisper of a word about this story. Funny, that.

CBC Radio's afternoon show host did conceed earlier yesterday that the "Liberal blogger" story was front-page news across the country. But, oddly enough, there was no mention of it on "The World at Six" or "As It Happens" -- and shucks, CBC TV had this pressing Pittsburg-Toronto hockey game on at 6:00 pm (on a Tuesday) so... no news at all. Tough luck, eh?

Like I said, sometimes our "public broadcaster" makes me peeeeee-YOOK!

[ 28 December 2005: Message edited by: Hephaestion ]


From: goodbye... :-( | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
writer
editor emeritus
Babbler # 2513

posted 28 December 2005 11:24 AM      Profile for writer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Ianno slams Liberal blog

Liberal MP Tony Ianno, whose re-election campaign in Trinity-Spadina riding was sideswiped by Mike Klander's racially charged blog entries, is condemning the antics of the Toronto Liberal organizer.



From: tentative | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
Pinko525
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Babbler # 10361

posted 28 December 2005 11:31 AM      Profile for Pinko525     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Ianno's crockadile tears are warming my heart!
From: Toronto | Registered: Sep 2005  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
Moderator
Babbler # 560

posted 28 December 2005 11:40 AM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
They may be crocodile tears, but to those who support him (or who might be swinging between the two), his statement will likely be enough to make it a non-issue for them. Most people don't accept guilt-by-association, especially if the person "associated" speaks out against it. It's not like it was Ianno's blog.

However, the Liberal campaign in Toronto Danforth should darn well be hurting over this! (Isn't that where this guy is the riding association president?)


From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Pinko525
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posted 28 December 2005 11:45 AM      Profile for Pinko525     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
It's too bad if it is Toronto Danforth, it's not like Jack Layton needs a lot of help there.
From: Toronto | Registered: Sep 2005  |  IP: Logged
writer
editor emeritus
Babbler # 2513

posted 28 December 2005 11:56 AM      Profile for writer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Harper says offensive blog will hurt Liberals ctv.ca
Single standard Winnipeg Free Press editorial
Harper, Copps chastise Liberals Hamilton Spectator
Canadian Liberal Party leader quits over racial blog newKerala.com (India)

From: tentative | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
writer
editor emeritus
Babbler # 2513

posted 28 December 2005 12:20 PM      Profile for writer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Sticking it to Teflon Grits no easy task

Scandal is a "discreditable" circumstance or event that brings a person into disgrace. Their reputations suffer but the need is to call an image repairman, not the police.

Corruption, on the other hand, is the "destruction" and "putrefaction" of an institution or from its intended purpose.

When people in public life discharge their duties in a corrupt way, by bribery, favouritism or stealing, they corrupt the institutions by which we are governed.

If the poll numbers are to move in the mean month of January, someone besides Gilles Duceppe is going to have to make that distinction.



From: tentative | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
Reverend Blair
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posted 28 December 2005 03:42 PM      Profile for Reverend Blair   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Does it bother anybody else that the Conservatives are playing this up so much? I mean, it isn't like they haven't had a member or two make racist, homophobic, insulting, and just downright stupid statements. Shouldn't their hypocrisy be pointed out along with a condemnation of the Liberals?
From: Winnipeg | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
josh
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Babbler # 2938

posted 28 December 2005 03:47 PM      Profile for josh     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Yes, it certainly is a case of crocodile tears. But it's no secret why they're playing it up.
From: the twilight zone between the U.S. and Canada | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
BCastro
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Babbler # 11420

posted 28 December 2005 04:04 PM      Profile for BCastro     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Does it bother anybody else that the Conservatives are playing this up so much?

Yes, but the MSM double standard and Liberal Party bias is an issue here.

In recent elections, if a Reformer, CCRAPer, Reform-a-Tory or non-Progressive Conservative candidate was found to be spouting racist, sexist, homophobic or other despicable garbage, then Liberal mouthpieces and their apologists in the MSM would be out there yelling that ALL of the Reformers, CCRAPers, Reform-a-Tories or non-Progressive Conservatives MUST be bigots, racists and/or homophobic Nazis.

In this case, Mike Klander is being portrayed as “just a volunteer,” a Joe Nobody, rather than the big time Paul Martin Liberal player/organizer/lobbyist he truly is/was.


From: Halifax | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
pogge
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Babbler # 2440

posted 28 December 2005 05:00 PM      Profile for pogge   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Sheila Copps weighs in: Liberals' seamy side
From: Why is this a required field? | Registered: Mar 2002  |  IP: Logged
writer
editor emeritus
Babbler # 2513

posted 28 December 2005 05:09 PM      Profile for writer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
I remember when, as a young high school student, he came into my office interested in knowing more about the Liberal party. His father was a diehard New Democrat, but Mike thought the Liberal Party might be a more realisitic way to help people. As a young man, he wanted to get involved to make things better. Over the years, it became simply about the win. My last images of Klander involve him working against me (and for the Martin/Tony Valeri side) in the ugly battle over the Liberal nomination in Hamilton East-Stoney Creek last year.

His blog struck me as stunning in its ignorance. No depth there, simply hate. Martin good, everyone else bad.

... In today's party machine, non-white voters are viewed as commodities, to be traded for seats which will guarantee a majority. The only difference in the Klander blog is that the public actually found out.


Ouch.


From: tentative | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 478

posted 28 December 2005 05:24 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
In the Martin backrooms, fitting in tends to mean "old boy" and bathroom humour, and ensuring your place is secured by tearing others down.

On the one hand, I do believe that is true of the Martin backrooms.

On the other, I tend to assume it is also true of a lot of other backrooms.

The only thing I don't like about Sheila's column, which hits so many targets so well, is the implication that only Martinite Liberals run by the old-fashioned macho rules.

In my experience, most of the world still runs by the old-fashioned macho rules. Often, babble still runs that way.


From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Doug
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Babbler # 44

posted 28 December 2005 09:55 PM      Profile for Doug   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Just goes to show, don't let your babies grow up to be Liberals.
From: Toronto, Canada | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Reality. Bites.
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posted 28 December 2005 10:23 PM      Profile for Reality. Bites.        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Doug:
Just goes to show, don't let your babies grow up to be Liberals.

Or cowboys.


From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004  |  IP: Logged
candle
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posted 29 December 2005 12:04 AM      Profile for candle     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Roy MacGregor's column today (Dec 28th) was about KlanderGate (page 2 of the Globe & Mail).
From: Ontario | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
Hephaestion
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Babbler # 4795

posted 29 December 2005 12:13 AM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
I hope WK realizes all this waiting is just whetting our appetites...
From: goodbye... :-( | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Reality. Bites.
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6718

posted 29 December 2005 12:21 AM      Profile for Reality. Bites.        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by pogge:
Sheila Copps weighs in: Liberals' seamy side

quote:
On it, Klander claims he will never run for office because he does not want to be forced to be nice to stupid people.

Poor lad. Guess that means he doesn't masturbate.


From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004  |  IP: Logged
Makwa
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posted 29 December 2005 12:31 AM      Profile for Makwa   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Hephaestion:
Oh, please forget that the last six minutes or so of the newscast was taken up by the gripping story of a Winnipeg family that tries to fit as many family members as possible on a toboggan)...
So Heph, don't leave me hanging - how many 'peggers can you fit on a boggin, and how many are FN, etc?

From: Here at the glass - all the usual problems, the habitual farce | Registered: Oct 2005  |  IP: Logged
Makwa
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posted 29 December 2005 12:39 AM      Profile for Makwa   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by RealityBites:
Poor lad. Guess that means he doesn't masturbate.
Hee he he he he he, (tears down face) yuk yuk yuk, oh dear (falls off chair).

From: Here at the glass - all the usual problems, the habitual farce | Registered: Oct 2005  |  IP: Logged
TheStudent
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Babbler # 11410

posted 29 December 2005 12:51 AM      Profile for TheStudent        Edit/Delete Post
It is gratifying to see a Liberal sleeze-bag go down hard. It would have been nicer to see Martin forces to fire him. I have to hope that Ianno condemning the statements won't help him, because really, this is what goes in the Liberal back room. If voters in Trinity-Spadina ignore this, it will be mindblowing.
From: Re-instate Audra Now! | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
Reverend Blair
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posted 29 December 2005 02:20 AM      Profile for Reverend Blair   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
So Heph, don't leave me hanging - how many 'peggers can you fit on a boggin, and how many are FN, etc?

Somebody stole my boggin. Of course if you leave a boggin in the back of an open truck in a bar parking lot in December, chances are that it will be gone when you come out.


From: Winnipeg | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
writer
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posted 29 December 2005 07:17 PM      Profile for writer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Layton slams Liberals for racist taunts against his wife, an NDP candidate

"I frankly never expected that we would face such things, that a candidate would be singled out," Layton said in his first public appearance since before Christmas.

"I certainly hope racial slurs will come to an end in this campaign."

Layton noted that Europeans who controlled portions of China in the past used to hang signs that read "no dogs or Chinese allowed," and said no Chinese person familiar with their history will ever forget those signs.

"This is no joke, and I think it's a culture of arrogance that has set in . . . and the election will have to deal with it," he said. "It reminds us that insults flow from arrogance. There is far too much of this in today's Liberal party."

Chow appeared with Layton later Thursday at a campaign event in the city's east Chinatown district, and said the comparisons to the dog on the Liberal website were hurtful.

"I think I was tremendously saddened," she said. "To have this kind of racial slur is humiliating. I think the true mask of the Liberal party has been taken off, and I certainly hope on Jan. 23 people will understand that it is time for a change."

Layton compared the web-based insult to school-yard behaviour, and said it's the same kind of discrimination many new Canadians face when they look for a job.

"That kind of attitude has no place in our country," he said. "Canada should not be governed by people who think that way."



From: tentative | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
Jimmy Brogan
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 3290

posted 29 December 2005 07:50 PM      Profile for Jimmy Brogan   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post

Separated at birth?


From: The right choice - Iggy Thumbscrews for Liberal leader | Registered: Nov 2002  |  IP: Logged
No Yards
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Babbler # 4169

posted 29 December 2005 07:55 PM      Profile for No Yards   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
There's no mistaking the high energy personality of one of those pictured, but who is that guy in the top photo?
From: Defending traditional marriage since June 28, 2005 | Registered: Jun 2003  |  IP: Logged
Fidel
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 5594

posted 29 December 2005 07:58 PM      Profile for Fidel     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Here's a photo of a black cat

Here's an image of a white cat.

And here's an image of a black and white cat

And here's the average sucker ... I mean Canadian at election time

[ 29 December 2005: Message edited by: Fidel ]


From: Viva La Revolución | Registered: Apr 2004  |  IP: Logged
Doug
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 44

posted 29 December 2005 08:30 PM      Profile for Doug   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
And here is a picture of Hitler's cat. Consider the thread Godwinned.

From: Toronto, Canada | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Hephaestion
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4795

posted 29 December 2005 08:55 PM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
Oh, I wouldn't say the topic is dead... CBC Radio was just reporting that the Chinese-Canadian community in Vancouver was "abuzz" over this and the latest case of liberal foot-in-mouth disease (Emmerson). I'd say the topic is far from toast.

[ 29 December 2005: Message edited by: Hephaestion ]


From: goodbye... :-( | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Hephaestion
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 4795

posted 30 December 2005 12:26 AM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
BTW, it was prolly kinda smart of Jack and Olivia to wait a couple of days to respond to all this. It means that, just by covering their responses, CBC Radio is still talking about these incidents... and getting more uncomplimentary all the time, too, surprisingly enough! This must just be driving the Liberals *nuts*!
From: goodbye... :-( | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Tickled Pink
recent-rabble-rouser
Babbler # 11489

posted 30 December 2005 08:01 AM      Profile for Tickled Pink     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Exactly, drag this story out. The worse the Liberals do the better.
From: Weston | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 478

posted 02 January 2006 08:55 AM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Well: on Saturday morning, the Grope and Flail used up a few lines at the bottom of their editorial column to attack Jack - that's right, to attack Jack! - for his response to Klander.

According to the editors of the Grope, calling Klander's vicious slur racist is way over the top and completely unjustified.

I read that editorial agog, trying to imagine the bitter, twisted little person who must have written it. Why take up any space at all to do anything but denounce vicious, unprovoked slurs? Why?


From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
majorvictory64
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Babbler # 7194

posted 03 January 2006 05:46 PM      Profile for majorvictory64     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Here's another commentary in that vein:

Bad NDP! Playing the race card against the Liberals!

quote:
NDP Leader Jack Layton and his wife Olivia Chow were in Toronto Thursday where they campaigned among the Chinese-Canadian community -- and characterized the offensive blog posting about her by a now-resigned Liberal official as racist. But was it a racist taunt?

...

Question: For those who say Mike Klander's post on Chow was racist, is it because Olivia Chow is Chinese? If she had been Caucasian and named Collie, and Klander did a similar photo comparison of her and a collie dog, would that have been equally offensive or less so? How about if he did it about a white man named Collie?

Klander was executive vice-president of the Ontario wing of the federal Liberal Party until he resigned on Boxing Day -- three days before Layton and Chow made their statements.

However, Layton and Chow didn't speak publicly about it until a day when they were appearing before Chinese-Canadian audiences (on Dec. 27, the NDP issued a statement about the Boxing Day shootings in Toronto).

They didn't say it was an attack from one person. Remember, Chow said: "To have this kind of racial slur is humiliating. I think the true mask of the Liberal party has been taken off, and I certainly hope on Jan. 23 people will understand that it is time for a change."

...

Question: Since the offending individual apologized and her opponent disavowed the insult, why didn't that end the matter for Chow and Layton?

One unpleasant answer could be that Chow and Layton are comfortable with the tactic of painting all Liberal Party members as anti-Chinese racists if it will hurt Liberal popularity (both their ridings have sizable Chinese-Canadian components).

They aren't alone. Here are remarks by Stephen Harper...



From: Toronto | Registered: Oct 2004  |  IP: Logged
writer
editor emeritus
Babbler # 2513

posted 03 January 2006 06:07 PM      Profile for writer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
[[[oopsie!]]]

[ 03 January 2006: Message edited by: writer ]


From: tentative | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
writer
editor emeritus
Babbler # 2513

posted 03 January 2006 06:07 PM      Profile for writer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Excerpts from letters in response to the Globe's editorial:

quote:
Your editorial, Ah, C'mon, Jack (Dec. 31) suggests New Democratic Leader Jack Layton can't take a joke. C'mon yourself; this is no joke. The name-calling of Mr. Layton and his wife Olivia Chow by a Liberal Party official was despicably low, vulgar and racist, and Mr. Layton was right to say so.

quote:
Your editorial excoriates Jack Layton for suggesting a racist dimension to Mike Klander's insult to Olivia Chow. I believe Mr. Layton was entirely realistic in making this connection. I base my belief on 27 years work in public transportation where, as an invisible servant, I have heard a broad cross-section of the public make appallingly racist remarks worthy of any 19th-century bigot.

[ 03 January 2006: Message edited by: writer ]


From: tentative | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
Krazee Eyes
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 11563

posted 03 January 2006 07:44 PM      Profile for Krazee Eyes        Edit/Delete Post
As someone who has faced racial discrimination, I think it's apalling that Jack Layton is trying to exploit this episode and paint all Liberals as racist. That's bullshit. And it is offensive to people of colour like me who have been systematically discriminated against all these many years.
From: You really wanna put your feet on my rug, don't'cha | Registered: Jan 2006  |  IP: Logged
Paul Gross
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 3576

posted 03 January 2006 08:13 PM      Profile for Paul Gross   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Krazee Eyes:
As someone who has faced racial discrimination, I think it's apalling that Jack Layton is trying to exploit this episode and paint all Liberals as racist. That's bullshit. And it is offensive to people of colour like me who have been systematically discriminated against all these many years.

Yes, I agree it would be apalling if Jack Layton tried to paint all Liberals as racist. But of course Jack did not do that.

Moving from the hypothetical to the actual: Krazee Eyes, as a "person of colour who has been discriminated against all these many years", how do you feel about the comments made by Klander?

[ 04 January 2006: Message edited by: Paul Gross ]


From: central Centretown in central Canada | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
Krazee Eyes
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 11563

posted 03 January 2006 09:19 PM      Profile for Krazee Eyes        Edit/Delete Post
I find it equally appalling as the attempt by the NDP to score cheap political brownie points over the comment.

Not only that, but muckraking, insults, and the like are done by parties which have no vision to offer the voters. The NDP, it appears, is all too keen on getting involved in this.


From: You really wanna put your feet on my rug, don't'cha | Registered: Jan 2006  |  IP: Logged
Reality. Bites.
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6718

posted 03 January 2006 09:22 PM      Profile for Reality. Bites.        Edit/Delete Post
I don't believe you're legit.

Perhaps in the future I'll be eating my words, but I don't think so.


From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004  |  IP: Logged
Contrarian
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6477

posted 03 January 2006 09:26 PM      Profile for Contrarian     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
As Antonia Zerbisias put it:
quote:
...Then there was the disgustingly sexist and racist chow-chow/Olivia Chow comparison made by Mike Klander, executive vice-president of the Liberal Party of Canada (Ontario) and president of the Toronto-Danforth Liberal Party Riding Association (my riding). Buh-bye. I am glad you won't be knocking on my door, mister...
Link here I agree with her; and as a woman, my opinion on the sexist part should be valid, shouldn't it?

From: pretty far west | Registered: Jul 2004  |  IP: Logged
Stargazer
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6061

posted 03 January 2006 09:28 PM      Profile for Stargazer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Me either. So that makes two of us...
From: Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist. | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
Vansterdam Kid
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 5474

posted 04 January 2006 02:36 AM      Profile for Vansterdam Kid   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by RealityBites:
I don't believe you're legit.

Perhaps in the future I'll be eating my words, but I don't think so.


Yeah, whenever they pop-up at just this time to try to spin it...their credibility goes down the toilet.

And Krazee you should know that there are plenty of people who are Persons of colour who have posted to the related topics since the subject first came up, pointing out that it was a racist comment and who focused on that, instead of defending the Liberal Party.


From: bleh.... | Registered: Apr 2004  |  IP: Logged
Albireo
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 3052

posted 04 January 2006 02:46 AM      Profile for Albireo     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
...and I'm pretty sure that none of them answered "my homies" to the question "How did you hear about rabble?" And most of them didn't disable personal messages, either.

[ 04 January 2006: Message edited by: Albireo ]


From: --> . <-- | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged
Reality. Bites.
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6718

posted 04 January 2006 07:49 AM      Profile for Reality. Bites.        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Vansterdam Kid:
Yeah, whenever they pop-up at just this time to try to spin it...their credibility goes down the toilet.

They never seem to understand that rabble - or any other board - is a community that people join and become a part of over time. People will always resent and suspect an outsider trying to use it as a short-term soapbox, doubly so when the claims defy belief.


From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004  |  IP: Logged
Cartman
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 7440

posted 04 January 2006 03:08 PM      Profile for Cartman        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
I don't believe you're legit.
Perhaps in the future I'll be eating my words, but I don't think so.
I wouldn't bother losing sleep over it.

From: Bring back Audra!!!!! | Registered: Nov 2004  |  IP: Logged
Krazee Eyes
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 11563

posted 04 January 2006 05:20 PM      Profile for Krazee Eyes        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by RealityBites:
I don't believe you're legit.

Perhaps in the future I'll be eating my words, but I don't think so.


I don't believe that yo can deny my experiences just because you disagree with my opinion. Bu thw way, in the interest of actual discussion, what is the nature of your disagreement with me, other than your ad hominem attack?

And you're questioning MY legitimacy?


From: You really wanna put your feet on my rug, don't'cha | Registered: Jan 2006  |  IP: Logged
Reality. Bites.
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6718

posted 04 January 2006 05:21 PM      Profile for Reality. Bites.        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Krazee Eyes:
I don't believe that yo can deny my experiences just because you disagree with my opinion.

I don't believe that you had them. I think you're a complete fake.


From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004  |  IP: Logged
Contrarian
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6477

posted 04 January 2006 05:49 PM      Profile for Contrarian     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Y'see Krazee, there's an election going on and we get a lot of infiltrators here; people who are not what they pretend to be. Now we have excellent moderators here, so the infiltrators don't last. The problem is much worse on other forums, such as a certain rightwing mouthfoaming site where they get people pretending to be Vietnam veterans and such like.
From: pretty far west | Registered: Jul 2004  |  IP: Logged
Krazee Eyes
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 11563

posted 04 January 2006 06:17 PM      Profile for Krazee Eyes        Edit/Delete Post
Is Reality Bites one of the moderators?
From: You really wanna put your feet on my rug, don't'cha | Registered: Jan 2006  |  IP: Logged
Scout
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 1595

posted 04 January 2006 06:29 PM      Profile for Scout     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Why?
From: Toronto, ON Canada | Registered: Oct 2001  |  IP: Logged
Krazee Eyes
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 11563

posted 05 January 2006 04:16 PM      Profile for Krazee Eyes        Edit/Delete Post
Because he or she's all in here criticizing other people like he's some kind of somebody or something. Like he or she knows what my experiences are. Like he or she gets to decide who's legit. I don't think RealityBites is legit, but is acting like King or Queen of the world or something.
From: You really wanna put your feet on my rug, don't'cha | Registered: Jan 2006  |  IP: Logged
writer
editor emeritus
Babbler # 2513

posted 05 January 2006 04:20 PM      Profile for writer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Krazee Eyes, your complaint is best directed to the moderators -

michelle@rabble.ca
audra@rabble.ca

You'll find an outline of how to send a compaint in the policy statement, which is found near the bottom right of any babble page (above the copyright).

[ 05 January 2006: Message edited by: writer ]


From: tentative | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
Makwa
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 10724

posted 05 January 2006 04:30 PM      Profile for Makwa   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Krazee Eyes:
And it is offensive to people of colour like me who have been systematically discriminated against all these many years.
Um, how so? As an FN person who "have been systematically discriminated against all these many years" I kinda like when whitey people of the caucasion persuasion gets on side and mean it. So what is your issue? (edited for revolting insensitivity)

[ 05 January 2006: Message edited by: Makwa ]


From: Here at the glass - all the usual problems, the habitual farce | Registered: Oct 2005  |  IP: Logged
writer
editor emeritus
Babbler # 2513

posted 05 January 2006 04:38 PM      Profile for writer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Why Makwa, you can call me a whitey people any old time! Or, to make me feel a bit more with it, how about whitey peeps?

Here's a shout out to my good race-traitor whitey peeps right now!

[ 05 January 2006: Message edited by: writer ]


From: tentative | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged
Krazee Eyes
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 11563

posted 05 January 2006 05:09 PM      Profile for Krazee Eyes        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by writer:
Krazee Eyes, your complaint is best directed to the moderators -

michelle@rabble.ca
audra@rabble.ca

You'll find an outline of how to send a compaint in the policy statement, which is found near the bottom right of any babble page (above the copyright).

[ 05 January 2006: Message edited by: writer ]


Thanks for letting me know of this.

I hope RealityBites reads this too and does the right thing from now on.

I'm just defending myself when attacked. Not that there's any point because I sink to the level of the poster who attecked me.

You give good advice Writer.


From: You really wanna put your feet on my rug, don't'cha | Registered: Jan 2006  |  IP: Logged
Reality. Bites.
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6718

posted 05 January 2006 05:50 PM      Profile for Reality. Bites.        Edit/Delete Post
I have not attacked you. I have said I don't believe you. That is my right, just as you have the right to say you don't believe I am legit, although I can't fathom what you think I am claiming to be that I'm not. I'm certainly not claiming to be a moderator or a reigning monarch.

Take heart, krazee eyes. For you see, if I DID believe you were a person of colour, I would be forced to conclude that you are remarkably stupid, and that would be insulting indeed, so naturaly I wouldn't say it.

In the meantime, if you wish to build up credibility here, you will not do so by sticking to one topic in one thread. By writing on a variety of topics, a pattern of your opinions emerges, from which people will judge you to be honest or not.


From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004  |  IP: Logged
Krazee Eyes
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 11563

posted 05 January 2006 06:28 PM      Profile for Krazee Eyes        Edit/Delete Post
And if you do have a real complaint, you would probably folllow Writer's advice above. It seems to me that you're just flakin' around and badmouthing people you don't like. This is why I was questioning whether you're legit. You can't bash people for not engaging in real debate when you don't do it yourself.

But thanks for your posting advice. I'll take it.

If you want to build up credibility, maybe you should focus on the the thread topic instead of bashing the people who are posting. Just advice, but I hope you take it.


From: You really wanna put your feet on my rug, don't'cha | Registered: Jan 2006  |  IP: Logged
TheStudent
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 11410

posted 05 January 2006 06:32 PM      Profile for TheStudent        Edit/Delete Post
RealityBites has been around here for a while. If you check, you will see that the date of registration is August of 2004. This means that RealityBites has built up credibility around here, by posting in a variety of threads on various topics.
From: Re-instate Audra Now! | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
Reality. Bites.
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6718

posted 05 January 2006 07:42 PM      Profile for Reality. Bites.        Edit/Delete Post
Krazee Eyes, you'll notice that right here in this thread, Stargazer, Vansterdam Kid, Albireo, Cartman and Contrarian question your legitimacy.

Why did you single me out?

Is it because I'm gay?


From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004  |  IP: Logged
jeff house
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 518

posted 05 January 2006 08:02 PM      Profile for jeff house     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I don't think we have any obligation to believe someone is a person of colour just because they say so.

Here, the poster appears on the board to make an argument that falsifies what Jack Layton said, and uses a claim to minority status to bolster his position.

It could be true...he has minority status and lies about Jack Layton.

Or, it could be that he lies about Jack Layton, and lies about his minority status.

Take your pick.


From: toronto | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
jeff house
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 518

posted 05 January 2006 08:27 PM      Profile for jeff house     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I would like to congratulate K. Eyes for his ability to reside in Kimberley, BC, which is:

quote:
Kimberley, a unique, four season resort with first class amenities. This is a friendly community with a strong sense of community pride and a commitment to make our visitors’ stay pleasant and memorable.

The well-planned growth of our golf courses, ski resort and real estate developments have contributed to Kimberley's prosperity and strong tourism-based economy. While you are here, be sure to stroll through the picturesque Platzl open air shopping quarter and visit the delightful shops and restaurants.


Not every person of colour can live where he does, in a really nice part of town, too!


From: toronto | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Reality. Bites.
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6718

posted 05 January 2006 08:44 PM      Profile for Reality. Bites.        Edit/Delete Post
These must be the homies that told him about rabble.

www.kiotac.ca


From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004  |  IP: Logged
Krazee Eyes
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 11563

posted 05 January 2006 09:12 PM      Profile for Krazee Eyes        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by RealityBites:

Why did you single me out?

Is it because I'm gay?


Oh man I hope you are not feeling this way. I didn't know you were gay. I am too. I singled you out because I thought your comments were rude and you were singling me out. You know, when you've lived with discrimination you become very distrustful of people you don't know, but I guess you know that. I'm sorry. And I'll ignore that last post of yours accusing me of being white. Not that there's anything wrong with that...


From: You really wanna put your feet on my rug, don't'cha | Registered: Jan 2006  |  IP: Logged
Reality. Bites.
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6718

posted 05 January 2006 09:24 PM      Profile for Reality. Bites.        Edit/Delete Post
My, my, gay AND black in a Bavarian-style resort town.

Any other minority statuses - any chance we can get them all at once?


From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004  |  IP: Logged
Krazee Eyes
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 11563

posted 05 January 2006 09:29 PM      Profile for Krazee Eyes        Edit/Delete Post
Sorry man you can't give it up. You're a hater and I'm not playing.
From: You really wanna put your feet on my rug, don't'cha | Registered: Jan 2006  |  IP: Logged
Contrarian
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6477

posted 05 January 2006 09:51 PM      Profile for Contrarian     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Krazee Eyes:
Sorry man you can't give it up. You're a hater and I'm not playing.
Gee, that sounds like the kind of thing they write on the dark side; funny thing, the people there have this obsession with RB, who is a valued member of babble. Is there a particular reason why you focussed on him rather than me or Stargazer or the others who question your veracity?

On the other hand, his is an NDP thread; why don't you tell us what you like about the NDP?


From: pretty far west | Registered: Jul 2004  |  IP: Logged
TheStudent
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 11410

posted 05 January 2006 10:03 PM      Profile for TheStudent        Edit/Delete Post
Interesting to note, K. Eyes has now changed how he heard about Babble to "internet." Ah, just gotta love revisionist history, eh?
From: Re-instate Audra Now! | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
Contrarian
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6477

posted 05 January 2006 10:22 PM      Profile for Contrarian     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
He also changed his location; I think the original one was Compton. So what does "You really wanna put your feet on my rug, don't'cha" mean exactly?
From: pretty far west | Registered: Jul 2004  |  IP: Logged
obscurantist
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 8238

posted 05 January 2006 11:23 PM      Profile for obscurantist     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I may be missing something, but where did K.E. (or anyone else) say that he was from Kimberley, B.C.? And how is it relevant?

I'm also not that worried about whether he's being honest about his race or sexuality, because I think his comments can be evaluated without bringing either of those factors into it. In other discussions, other people have provided enough context for me to accept their self-descriptions as true, or to suspect that their self-descriptions are false. And sometimes (i.e., not always) I find their reference to personal experience to provide some insight into a point that's being discussed. K.E.'s comments so far about his identity and experiences have been at a fairly general level. And that's fine for now. Perhaps he'll go into greater detail, and perhaps not.

As it stands, he hasn't articulated his views on this thread to a point where I can understand why he holds those views, so until he does, I'll continue to disagree with him. On the other hand, I agree to a certain extent with what he said in his first post on the thread about outing public figures, as I said there.


From: an unweeded garden | Registered: Feb 2005  |  IP: Logged
Reality. Bites.
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6718

posted 05 January 2006 11:50 PM      Profile for Reality. Bites.        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by obscurantist:
I may be missing something, but where did K.E. (or anyone else) say that he was from Kimberley, B.C.? And how is it relevant?

Postal code.

And when a town has a black population of 40 people, 0.6% of the population, it's kinda relevant I think. The experience would be somewhat different from being black in Calgary, with 13 thousand others.


From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004  |  IP: Logged
obscurantist
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 8238

posted 06 January 2006 12:15 AM      Profile for obscurantist     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Okay -- I missed the postal code. But still, aren't posters here more likely to be evasive about their real postal code than about other personal information? As has been noted in the past, your postal code isn't M5W 1E6. And my postal code isn't V8P 1K7.
From: an unweeded garden | Registered: Feb 2005  |  IP: Logged
kartini
recent-rabble-rouser
Babbler # 11395

posted 06 January 2006 08:14 AM      Profile for kartini        Edit/Delete Post
They never seem to understand that rabble - or any other board - is a community that people join and become a part of over time. People will always resent and suspect an outsider trying to use it as a short-term soapbox, doubly so when the claims defy belief.

and

Y'see Krazee, there's an election going on and we get a lot of infiltrators here; people who are not what they pretend to be. Now we have excellent moderators here, so the infiltrators don't last.

*
Is this true? I thought the reason for all this was to have a forum to share opinions from wherever they come from.

On my first post (it was incomplete because I made a mistake) I got flamed right away,saying I was a fake poster making a fake post. Can someone tell me why?

And I don't have a postal code where I come from. Sorry.


From: china | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
Reality. Bites.
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 6718

posted 06 January 2006 08:39 AM      Profile for Reality. Bites.        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by obscurantist:
Okay -- I missed the postal code. But still, aren't posters here more likely to be evasive about their real postal code than about other personal information? As has been noted in the past, your postal code isn't M5W 1E6.

Well of course mine was chosen to obviously show that it's not my real postal code, rather than to mislead people into thinking I live somewhere I don't.

In KE's case though, there are just too many things that raise red flags. PMs turned off, claims that don't jibe, statements that are demonstrably false, ever-changing profile info and a complete lack of interest in answering anyone who has challenged him except me.


From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004  |  IP: Logged

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