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Author Topic: Microsoft Caves To Religious Right and Withdraws Support of Gay Rights
remind
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posted 22 April 2005 04:34 AM      Profile for remind     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Okay I am now ready to give up utilizing any and all microsoft products. There should be a swift and terrible backlash against them by progressives.

Microsoft Comes Under Fire for Reversal on Gay Rights Bill
By SARAH KERSHAW

Published: April 22, 2005


SEATTLE, April 21 - The Microsoft Corporation, at the forefront of corporate gay rights for decades, is coming under fire from gay rights groups, politicians and its own employees for withdrawing its support for a state bill that would have barred discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation.

Many of the critics accused the company of bowing to pressure from a prominent evangelical church in Redmond, Wash., located a few blocks from Microsoft's sprawling headquarters.

The bill, or similar versions of it, has been introduced repeatedly over three decades; it failed by one vote Thursday in the State Senate. Gay rights advocates denounced Microsoft, which had supported the bill for the last two years, for abandoning their cause. Blogs and online chat rooms were buzzing on Thursday with accusations that the company, which has offered benefits to same-sex partners for years, had given in to the Christian right.

NY Times


From: "watching the tide roll away" | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
Hephaestion
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posted 22 April 2005 11:09 AM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Oh. my. Gawd.

Microflop is more interested in The Bottom Line than fairness and justice?

STOP DA PRESSES!!!

I never trusted them for a millisecond, anyway, and certainly would never have relied on them to any great extent.


From: goodbye... :-( | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Américain Égalitaire
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posted 22 April 2005 11:16 AM      Profile for Américain Égalitaire   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
When I read the NYT article, my heart sank for more than one reason.

That asshole Hutcherson was in town about a month ago for the yearly Christo-fascist party rally, eh, I mean Mayor's Prayer Breakfast, and I, of course, had to cover it.

That goddamn bastard.

I was alotted only about 12 inches so I could not get into a lot of the off color racial jokes he made to the delight of the lily white crowd. One thing I did write and was published was this:

quote:
Hutcherson's appearance stirred some last minute controversy when John Herbert, executive director of Legion Arts urged Prayer Breakfast host Cedar Rapids Mayor Paul Pate not to attend. Herbert said Hutcherson publicly calls homosexuality a sin and the city has a provision in its code not to discriminate against gays and lesbians.

Neither Pate nor Hutcherson spoke to the controversy or the homosexual issue during the prayer breakfast but Hutcherson made it clear he's convinced of the inerrancy of Scripture and the primacy of Christianity.

Hutcherson recalled striking up a conversation about his faith with a Muslim cab driver in Europe. Everything Hutcherson recalled saying about Christ, the driver said was true of Muhammad the prophet.

``Well Jesus died and rose again for his people,'' Hutcherson recalled saying. ``Well Muhammad has not made it back yet,'' Hutcherson recalled the cab driver saying.

``All religions are all religions, but I am not a Christian because I believe all religions are the same,'' Hutcherson said.


Oh, the hundreds in attendance just loved that. Baiting a Muslim cab driver. Oh how nice.

We didn't receive one letter to the editor in protest. Not one. And the local Muslim community is lying so low, they didn't say anything either. There is real fear out there.

Folks, I try and try and try to impart a sense of how close we are to real theocratic governance in this country. For powerful Microsoft to back down like this is the clearest signal yet that we are going further into that dark age in the US. When businesses like Microsoft for pity sakes, make decisions that strike at the heart of some of their most creative people (who may now go elsewhere) we have reached a serious point in the history of civil rights in the US. This incident will only EMBOLDEN the Christo-haters and lead to more of these bully boy tactics.

I am so mad right now, I need to get up and take a walk.


From: Chardon, Ohio USA | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged
Américain Égalitaire
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posted 22 April 2005 11:25 AM      Profile for Américain Égalitaire   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Addendum:

I love it when these so-called Christian ministers and other talk about how much they "love the sinner but the hate the sin" and that they are only trying to save these poor gay people from Hell by telling them biblical truth because they "love" them.

Well demanding that people BE FIRED for speaking publicly in the state assembly is NOT AN ACT OF LOVE BUT PURE, RAW, UNDILUTED HATE!


From: Chardon, Ohio USA | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged
Américain Égalitaire
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posted 22 April 2005 11:30 AM      Profile for Américain Égalitaire   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Addendum, addendum.

Check out the immigration ad (top left) for same sex couples to move to Canada.


From: Chardon, Ohio USA | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged
Amy
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posted 22 April 2005 12:30 PM      Profile for Amy   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
After that, "they backed off," the pastor said Thursday in a telephone interview. "I told them I was going to give them something to be afraid of Christians about," he said

Wow, that's not a threat or antyhing. HOLY SHIT.


From: the whole town erupts and/ bursts into flame | Registered: Feb 2002  |  IP: Logged
remind
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posted 22 April 2005 12:30 PM      Profile for remind     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I agree with you EA, this is going to push the neofascist fundamentalists both here and in the USA to even greater control actions.

Perhaps some still do not realize just what is happening and see them as kooks who will go away. They won't unless there is just as strong as a movement against them.


From: "watching the tide roll away" | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
WingNut
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posted 22 April 2005 12:34 PM      Profile for WingNut   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I have a solution to the M$ sellout:

Linux Sex Positions - The Open Source Kama Sutra featuring Lesbian and Gay Sex Positions


From: Out There | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
remind
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posted 22 April 2005 03:27 PM      Profile for remind     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Well, I can see the point/juxposition of Newbies other thread title on this action of microsoft in a weird way, but as of yet at least, it overstates the action and its outcome.

I "believe" newbies point was:

"BMW surrenders to Nazis, and agrees to transport Jewish employees to death camps."

=

Microsoft surrenders to Neo-fundamentalist evangelicals and agrees to transport gay employees to prisons.

Though I suppose I could be wrong, and he got the wrong thread link.


From: "watching the tide roll away" | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
Draco
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posted 22 April 2005 03:57 PM      Profile for Draco     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Microsoft's decision not to endorse the anti-discrimination bill and its meetings with Dr. Hutcherson were first reported Thursday by The Stranger, an alternative weekly newspaper in Seattle.

... [Microsoft] said they had examined their legislative priorities and decided that because they already offer extensive benefits to gay employees... they should focus on other legislative matters.


After reading the article, my understanding of Washington state's government is that Bills approved by the State House are sent to Microsoft for endorsement before being sent to the State Senate for final approval.


From: Wild Rose Country | Registered: Jan 2004  |  IP: Logged
NDP Newbie
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posted 22 April 2005 04:31 PM      Profile for NDP Newbie     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by remind:
Well, I can see the point/juxposition of Newbies other thread title on this action of microsoft in a weird way, but as of yet at least, it overstates the action and its outcome.

I "believe" newbies point was:

"BMW surrenders to Nazis, and agrees to transport Jewish employees to death camps."

=

Microsoft surrenders to Neo-fundamentalist evangelicals and agrees to transport gay employees to prisons.

Though I suppose I could be wrong, and he got the wrong thread link.


No it doesn't. Hitler also started "small".


From: Cornwall, ON | Registered: Mar 2004  |  IP: Logged
Hephaestion
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posted 22 April 2005 04:59 PM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Here's a few contact people and their contact info. if anyone wants it:

quote:

- Jim Desler,
Microsoft US
425-703-6061
jdesler@microsoft.com

- Dirk Delmartino,
Microsoft Europe
+32 (0)2 550 06 21
dirkdelm@microsoft.com

- The firm handling public policy for Microsoft in DC:
The Glover Park Group
Washington, DC
202-337-0808

- The firm handling Microsoft's "rapid response" to questions:
Waggener Edstrom Rapid Response Team
rrt@wagged.com
503-443-7070

- Media Relations for Microsoft
Global Communications & Television
(212) 339-9920
mediarelations@gctv.com

- Microsoft Investor Relations
Curt Anderson
(425) 706-3703

- Walt McGraw, Edelman, (206) 223-1606, walt.mcgraw@edelman.com

- Shon Damron, Edelman, (323) 857-9100, shon.damron@edelman.com

- Carlos de Leon,tel. 425-703-3824, or carlosde@microsoft.com

- Katie Goldberg, tel. 206-268-2244, or katie.goldberg@edelman.com


courtesy of AMERICAblog


From: goodbye... :-( | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
remind
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posted 22 April 2005 06:40 PM      Profile for remind     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Thanks Heph, I will be writing even more letters and e-mails.

Newbie, I said as of yet, and yes Hitler did start small. And yes, I do think some people are still undr estimating the way things are going, or perhaps just too worn down.

Either way, the slope is tilting sharply, and I did not know will not be a good enough excuse.


From: "watching the tide roll away" | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
Joe Emery
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posted 22 April 2005 11:45 PM      Profile for Joe Emery     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Thanks to all who have donated to this thread. I am afraid that here in the heart of the country we are at the mercy of the Christian Right and our own apathy/unwillingness to fear what they can and will do. Recently, Kansas voters approved an ammendment to our state constitution making marriage between one man and one woman, period. Never mind that there was already an old law on the books stating that marriage was between one man and one woman, the Conservative Christian Wakkos wanted to push it as a part of the constitution so that "activist judges" wouldn't try to reinterpret the law and end up giving mariage rights to gays and lesbians. And as if that weren't enough, a part of the language of the new ammendment states that no other form of union or partnership would carry the rights and privelidges of marriage. So if my friend who is gay and has been with his same partner for 25 years becomes sick, his partner can be denied visitation rights. Kansas is just one of many states that have made this an issue. And as some have mentioned earlier, it sickened me to learn that it had passed here and passed with 70% voting for it, no less.
From: Wichita, KS | Registered: Apr 2005  |  IP: Logged
UWSofty
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posted 23 April 2005 08:12 PM      Profile for UWSofty   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I thought some insider information might bring some perspective to this discussion.

On Friday, a bunch of Microsoft employees on my team were sitting around talking after work, and one guy who used to be the President of GLEAM (Gay and Lesbian Employees at Microsoft) was asked about this. Coincidently, he was the one who managed to convince Microsoft to voice support for this anti-discrimination bill in first place, about 2 years ago.

In his opinion, he believed Microsoft withdrawing its support for the bill is what in fact killed it. It lost by one vote, and Microsoft's lobbying has been enough to change the votes of some particular senators in the past (senators who voted against it this time). Although he did point out that one of the Senators who often towed the Microsoft line in the past is now the Republican minority leader and would have been less likely to follow suit this time.

He also said it probably would have been better if Microsoft had never supported the bill in the first place, because changing its position to neutral looked worse then being neutral all along. I just found it amazing that Microsoft wields that much influence here. Although considering the number of people it employs and the money it brings into the state, it shouldn’t have come as a surprise.

The other interesting point he brought up was that he didn’t think Microsoft changed its position based on the “fundamentalist nut’s opinion” (his words), an opinion confirmed by a recent email to MS employees by Steve Ballmer. Brad Smith (MS top lawyer) had already decided to withdraw the support because he didn’t think it was appropriate. His 2 big mistakes were: 1) citing the fundamentalist nut as a reason for withdrawing support; and 2) saying this decision was to address concerns of Christian employees. What a dumb thing to say.

My co-worker stressed that Microsoft treated it’s gay and lesbian employees really well. The only complaint GLEAM has is that Microsoft doesn’t give the same benefits to trans-gendered employees that it does to gays and lesbians.

Anyway, it was a really interesting conversation. It was enlightening hearing about the lack of laws in the U.S. to protect gays and lesbians against discrimination and hearing almost all of my co-workers speak passionately in favour of laws to protect them. Who would have expected to find so many progressive voices in the heart of big, bad, evil Microsoft?


From: Vancouver | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged
Américain Égalitaire
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posted 23 April 2005 11:24 PM      Profile for Américain Égalitaire   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
And I tremble for tomorrow:

For its Justice Sunday

My blog entry: Barbarians at the Gates


From: Chardon, Ohio USA | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged
radiorahim
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 2777

posted 23 April 2005 11:52 PM      Profile for radiorahim     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Well folks there is something you can do about it...although having read UWSofty's post I suppose M$ might not be totally at fault...

You can start here!

Linux.org

Linux Questions.org

Just Linux

Tux Magazine

Welcome to this friendly little bird!

[ 23 April 2005: Message edited by: radiorahim ]


From: a Micro$oft-free computer | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged
UWSofty
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posted 24 April 2005 01:48 AM      Profile for UWSofty   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Just because Microsoft isn't totally at fault, that's no reason not to switch to Linux . I'm only working here as an intern for another week, and then I can install Linux on my laptop and dual-boot without guilt. It's all about using the right tool for the job. There are somethings that Windows is really good and it some things Linux is really good at.
From: Vancouver | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged
Hephaestion
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posted 25 April 2005 10:12 AM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Microflop: It was all about privacy! Really! We mean it! C'mon, ya GOTTA believe us!

quote:
In a hastily prepared internal memo e-mailed to employees, Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer is attempting to shoot down suggestions that pressure from a local pastor triggered the company's decision not to publicly support a gay-rights bill before the state Legislature this year.

Reiterating statements made by company spokespeople in recent days, Ballmer said the decision to take a neutral position on legislation Microsoft had supported previously was made before the session started in January.

The intent was to enable the software company to focus on computer privacy, education and other issues more directly related to its business, he said.

"I understand that many employees may disagree with the company's decision to tighten the focus of our agenda for this year's legislative session in Olympia," Ballmer wrote.

"But I want every employee to understand that the decision to take a neutral stance on this bill was taken before the Session began based on a desire to focus our legislative efforts, not in reaction to any outside pressure," Ballmer wrote in the Friday evening e-mail.

[...]

Ballmer said that personally, both be and Chairman Bill Gates supported the gay-rights bill.

"But that is my personal view, and I also know that many employees and shareholders would not agree with me." he wrote.

"We are thinking hard about what is the right balance to strike — when should a public company take a position on a broader social issue, and when should it not? What message does the company taking a position send to its employees who have strongly held beliefs on the opposite side of the issue?"

On Friday, The L.A. Gay & Lesbian Center asked Microsoft to return a civil-rights award the organization gave the company four years ago


"But that is my personal view"... gutless bastards! Oh well, it's not like I support anything Microflop puts out, anyway...


From: goodbye... :-( | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Américain Égalitaire
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posted 25 April 2005 10:37 AM      Profile for Américain Égalitaire   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
lame lame lame.

Shameful.


From: Chardon, Ohio USA | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged
Papal Bull
rabble-rouser
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posted 25 April 2005 08:19 PM      Profile for Papal Bull   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Microsoft just lost a customer in the childish console wars
From: Vatican's best darned ranch | Registered: Oct 2004  |  IP: Logged
pogge
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posted 27 April 2005 12:40 AM      Profile for pogge   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Microsoft paying Religious Right leader Ralph Reed $20,000 a month retainer

quote:
AMERICAblog.com has learned that Microsoft is currently paying a $20,000 a month retainer to former Christian Coalition head Ralph Reed's consulting firm Century Strategies. Which now begs the question of whether Reed was in any way involved with Microsoft's recent decision to abandon its decades long support for gay civil rights in order to curry favor with anti-gay bigots of the radical right.

More at the link. This certainly makes things interesting.


From: Why is this a required field? | Registered: Mar 2002  |  IP: Logged
Grainne
rabble-rouser
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posted 27 April 2005 01:03 AM      Profile for Grainne     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
When you combined Linux with a front-end like Red Hat, it becomes just as easy to use (and much more powerful) than Windows.

Oh, and Mozilla Firefox and Thunderbird kick Internet Exploiter's and Outlook's collective arse hands-down. And they're both free, open-source products.

Also check out OpenOffice.

And just in case caving to the religious right isn't enough to get you to stop using Microsoft products, how about this:

They suck.

If you're running Windows and Exploiter, (any versions), your computer has so many security holes not even Microsoft can count them. That's why there's a new security patch every month.

--g


From: Toronto | Registered: Feb 2005  |  IP: Logged
Hephaestion
rabble-rouser
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posted 29 April 2005 07:46 AM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Bill Gates speaks...

quote:
"Next time this one comes around, we'll see," Gates said in the story published Tuesday. "We certainly have a lot of employees who sent us mail. Next time it comes around that'll be a major factor for us to take into consideration."

Microsoft, one of the first companies to offer domestic partner benefits to gay employees, has denied that the pastor or anyone else outside the company influenced its decision. Gates said executives weren't expecting a backlash.

"Well, we didn't expect that kind of visibility for it," Gates told The Times. "After all, Microsoft's position on a political bill, has that ever caused something to pass or not pass? Is it good, is it bad? I don't know."

[...]

Gay rights groups have said they feel betrayed. On Friday, the Los Angeles Gay & Lesbian Center asked Microsoft to return of a civil rights award it gave the company in 2001. Liberal Web bloggers have urged their critics to organize their own Microsoft boycott.

Gates said he welcomed the feedback.

"It's perfectly fair for us to be scrutinized on anything," Gates said. "We didn't realize that one would get that level of scrutiny, but there's people who care a lot. They care a lot about the issue."



From: goodbye... :-( | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Américain Égalitaire
rabble-rouser
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posted 29 April 2005 10:01 AM      Profile for Américain Égalitaire   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
$20k a month to Ralph Reed?!??!

Screw 'em. Guity as charged.

Gates is such a PR disaster, half the time he doesn't know what his company is up to. He lives in another world.

This is just so sick and disgusting. Ralph Reed. God, what is this country coming to. Of all companies, I thought one could at least count on Microsoft to play fair and respect their LGBT employees. But no, they're caving in.

More here on how all of this is spreading


From: Chardon, Ohio USA | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged
Crippled_Newsie
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posted 06 May 2005 03:52 PM      Profile for Crippled_Newsie     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Microsoft recants?

quote:
Microsoft will continue to join other leading companies in supporting federal legislation that would prohibit employment discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation – adding sexual orientation to the existing law that already covers race, sex, national origin, religion, age and disability. Given the importance of diversity to our business, it is appropriate for the company to endorse legislation that prohibits employment discrimination on all of these grounds.

Obviously, the Washington State legislative session has concluded for this year, but if legislation similar to HB 1515 is introduced in future sessions, we will support it.



From: It's all about the thumpa thumpa. | Registered: Oct 2004  |  IP: Logged
Kinetix
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posted 06 May 2005 06:17 PM      Profile for Kinetix     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Microsoft recants!

No ? about it.


From: Montréal, Québec | Registered: Mar 2004  |  IP: Logged
remind
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posted 06 May 2005 07:48 PM      Profile for remind     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Yes, letter writing so helps things and broadcasting it out to everyone.

Another blow to the soc-con network. It seems like people have reached their limit of patience with the bigots of the world.


From: "watching the tide roll away" | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
radiorahim
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posted 06 May 2005 08:42 PM      Profile for radiorahim     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Well for those who want to kiss Microsoft goodbye there's a thread over here
From: a Micro$oft-free computer | Registered: Jun 2002  |  IP: Logged
Hephaestion
rabble-rouser
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posted 23 January 2006 05:39 AM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Almost there...

Gay civil rights bill passes Washington State House

quote:
Legislation banning discrimination against gays, lesbians, and the transgendered in jobs and housing was passed in the state House on Friday. The measure was approved on a 60-37 vote.

"This discrimination is a reality,2 said Rep. Ed Murray (D-Seattle) leading off final debate on the bill and working diffuse critics who claim there had been no proof the legislation was needed.

The no votes came mainly from Republicans. 

"We think this needs to go the people," said House Minority Leader Richard DeBolt (R-Chehalis). 3We don1t think we should impede on the religious freedom."

LGBT civil rights groups have been trying for 30 years to get legislation. The bill now moves to the Senate where it was defeated last year by one vote. Majority Leader Sen. Lisa Brown (D-Spokane), a supporter of the measure, said the upper chamber will act on the bill quickly.

It is expected the legislation will pass the Senate this time. The senator who cast the deciding vote now says he will support the measure. The legislation also has the support of some of the biggest corporations in the state including Microsoft, Boeing, Hewlett Packard and Nike.

Last year's defeat of the measure was blamed on Microsoft which originally supported the bill but reversed its stand after threats from a local evangelist to call a national boycott of the computer giant.


I've been following this story on US-ian news out of Seattle, and some of the backlash from the 'phobes has been vicious, nasty and ugly. Props go to the KOMO TV's Ken Schramm for his strong on-air opinion pieces in defence of equal civil rights for all. He has been villified in some quarters, and has received a bunch of nasty e-mail; he read some on-air just the other night. Made the 'phobes look like what they are -- ignorant bigots.

And now, the state senate...

[ 23 January 2006: Message edited by: Hephaestion ]


From: goodbye... :-( | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
baba yaga
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posted 25 January 2006 06:39 PM      Profile for baba yaga     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Well, some good news for a change. I wonder what made Microsoft come to its senses. Yay Seattle! (My daughter lives/works between there & the San Juan Islands.)
From: urban forests | Registered: Sep 2004  |  IP: Logged
Michael Watkins
rabble-rouser
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posted 25 January 2006 07:43 PM      Profile for Michael Watkins   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Evangelical, and stupid (with their money):

quote:
Microsoft Gay-Rights Stance May Spark a Stock Boycott (Update2)

Jan. 20 (Bloomberg) -- Microsoft Corp.'s support for gay- rights legislation in Washington State has local evangelical Christian ministers readying a counterattack. One possible weapon, they say: boycotting the software maker's stock.

``This isn't something we intend to just let slide,'' says Joseph Fuiten, a pastor in Bothell, Washington, who leads Positive Christian Agenda, an umbrella organization for 35 religious groups. ``In the view of a lot of evangelicals, they have overstepped their bounds. It's muscle time.''

Ken Hutcherson, pastor of Antioch Bible Church in Redmond, Washington, where Microsoft is based, is coordinating the opposition, according to Fuiten. He will likely urge church members nationwide to divest shares in Microsoft and other companies that support the legislation, Fuiten says.

``There are about 63 million evangelicals in America, and so we work in a lot of mutual funds and investment portfolios,'' says Fuiten, 56. ``If you could make Microsoft's stock drop by $1 a share, you cost Bill Gates $200 million.''

More


The financial community would love a bunch of zealots to cause a MSFT drop of significance; the secular investment community, as well as the faithful driven by profits not religion, would jump on the chance to buy them up at value prices.

I know... the intolerant folks can print a T-Shirt up later, once they realize what's happened.

My Church Said Boycott MSFT,
I lost a bundle and all I got
was this god-damned t-shirt


From: Vancouver Kingway - Democracy In Peril | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
nevermind
rabble-rouser
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posted 26 January 2006 11:36 AM      Profile for nevermind     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
two points of trouble here...corporations always care only about the bottom line...this is not much different from Goggles bowing to the Chinese....

and we never blame society as much as we shouldif the were fewer fundermentalist biggots with less clout no corporation would listen to them

societies must always take the blame for the actions of the elite...they allow and encourage them to do


From: Ontario | Registered: Jun 2005  |  IP: Logged
Rufus Polson
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posted 26 January 2006 01:53 PM      Profile for Rufus Polson     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Draco:

After reading the article, my understanding of Washington state's government is that Bills approved by the State House are sent to Microsoft for endorsement before being sent to the State Senate for final approval.

Probably not too far off.


From: Caithnard College | Registered: Nov 2002  |  IP: Logged
Rufus Polson
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posted 26 January 2006 01:57 PM      Profile for Rufus Polson     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by UWSofty:
Who would have expected to find so many progressive voices in the heart of big, bad, evil Microsoft?

Educated, nonmacho urbanites in Washington state (which is normally an unusually sane part of the US); I'm not surprised. Microsoft isn't bad because its employees are a bunch of evil people. Microsoft is bad because of the way corporations are structured and monopolies work.


From: Caithnard College | Registered: Nov 2002  |  IP: Logged
Jason J. W. Lisenchuk
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posted 27 January 2006 02:16 AM      Profile for Jason J. W. Lisenchuk   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
All's well that ends well, but it is disturbing to think that M$ had initially withdrawn support for this bill, however brieflty.

M$ is HQ'd in one of the most liberal cities in the US, has more money than God (metaphor carefully chosen), has lots of gay employees (as does any high tech or creative firm), and Gates has always been rumoured as a closet Democrat.

Should Christ return to earth, I don't know what would happen first. Would the religious right be the first against the wall, or would they see to it that Christ was crucified a second time?

You only have to hit a bully once, and he will never bother you again.

Jas

[ 27 January 2006: Message edited by: Jason J. W. Lisenchuk ]


From: Toronto, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Sep 2003  |  IP: Logged
Sven
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posted 27 January 2006 02:53 AM      Profile for Sven     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Rufus Polson:
Microsoft is bad because of the way corporations are structured and monopolies work.

If corporations are, by definition, evil, how about if you start a coop to make the next hybrid car?


From: Eleutherophobics of the World...Unite!!!!! | Registered: Jul 2005  |  IP: Logged
Rufus Polson
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posted 27 January 2006 02:59 PM      Profile for Rufus Polson     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Cuz I live in a capitalist society and I ain't got no capital. Any more inane questions?
From: Caithnard College | Registered: Nov 2002  |  IP: Logged
Hephaestion
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Babbler # 4795

posted 28 January 2006 12:59 AM      Profile for Hephaestion   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Well, it cleared the Senate

quote:
The Washington state Senate voted 25-23 Friday to pass an LGBT civil rights bill that ends a 30 year struggle by gays...

From: goodbye... :-( | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged

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