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Author Topic: Jihad Solution.
John I. Fleming
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Babbler # 1846

posted 22 December 2001 02:23 AM      Profile for John I. Fleming        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
In the years preceding World War I, General Pershing was commander of the American forces in the Philippines. The small Moslem community on the island nation began to wreak havoc against the Philippine government and American forces.

The American troops captured a large group of these terrorists. During the interrogation by the Military Court, the fanatics were heard to repeatedly shout, "Allah Achbar! Allah Achbar! Jihad! The Philippines are the lands of Islam!"

Pershing ordered the Amalekites executed, one by one, in the presence of the whole group.

Now, Moslems will not eat pork believing that no one could enter Paradise if there is even the smallest amount of swine flesh in their bodies. Knowing this, the General first ordered the firing squad to shoot large hogs.

After they skinned the swine, the executioners rolled their bullets in pork fat and passed fat through the barrels of their rifles while the condemned men watched.

As each condemned terrorist was executed, his corpse was wrapped in hog's skin and buried on the spot. The entrails of the swine were dumped over the corpse before the grave was covered. Three of the convicted Amalekites were released to take the news back to their Islamic communities.

That ended the Islamic Jihad in the Philippines. Terrorist incidents from Islamic Fundamentalists were unheard of until a decade ago when the U.S. State Department recognized the PLO as legitimate Freedom Fighters.

Unfortunately the current world crisis with the Palistinians in the Middle East, Moslem and Islamic fundamentalists in Afganistan and Pakistan, we must take some sort of action. Whether the reaction be reflective to that of General Persing or not, something must be done. We can't just hold up placards condeming wars like so many socialists would like to do. There has been too much innocent blood shed for us to just stand there like pacifists.

John I. Fleming

[ December 22, 2001: Message edited by: John I. Fleming ]

[ December 22, 2001: Message edited by: John I. Fleming ]


From: Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
clockwork
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posted 22 December 2001 03:52 AM      Profile for clockwork     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Whether the reaction be reflective to that of General Persing or not, something must be done.

Obviously he didn’t go far enough. We need to spit on the graves, too.

I say lets use the world’s nuclear arsenal for good. We can blow up the planet a hundred times over. Why not do that? Let God or whoever sort us out. Religious people should like this option since they get to go to their own creators. Atheists shouldn’t mind since once we’re dead… we’re dead, we don’t care. Molecules in a dead body no longer make value judgments.


From: Pokaroo! | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Doug
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posted 22 December 2001 03:56 AM      Profile for Doug   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Considering that Islamic fundamentalism in the Phillipines is still very much an issue, I'd say that it didn't work out in the long run.
From: Toronto, Canada | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Tommy_Paine
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Babbler # 214

posted 22 December 2001 08:12 AM      Profile for Tommy_Paine     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
*snicker*

An eight paragraph rant shot down in Flems by one sentence.

Fancy shootin' Doug.


From: The Alley, Behind Montgomery's Tavern | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
WingNut
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posted 22 December 2001 09:12 AM      Profile for WingNut   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
And then they ask: "Why do they hate us?"
From: Out There | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
Mohamad Khan
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posted 22 December 2001 11:00 AM      Profile for Mohamad Khan   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
a very instructive story...with a baffling conclusion. the anecdote seems to demonstrate the self-perpetuating nature of violence, yet Mr Fleming ends by blasting the pacifist position. it seems that the story itself is implicitly an argument against the author's analysis.
From: "Glorified Harlem": Morningside Heights, NYC | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
Markbo
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posted 22 December 2001 11:14 AM      Profile for Markbo     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
And then they ask: "Why do they hate us?"

Of all the ways to refute Dr. Fleming, that is not one of them. Since they will hate us no matter what we do. According to them as long as we remain alive.

Personally I prefer Sending these Islamic terrorist who pevert islam to Sweden where sex change operations and electrolysis can be performed on them so that they can live out their lives as women.

What this thread fails to recognize is that we are not dealing with peoples religious faiths here. We are dealing with people who have peverted a religion. They pevert their religion to follow their goals. If we performed the pig stuff. Bin Laden and his evil cohorts will pevert the religion of islam to say that it makes them Super martyrs.

Anyone who could pevert the word jihad from a personal struggle to killing innocents should have no problem altering the rules of dealing with swine. In fact they themselves are swine.

Sorry I take that back. Pigs do not deserve to be lowered to Bin Laden's level.


From: Windsor | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Apemantus
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posted 22 December 2001 12:29 PM      Profile for Apemantus        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
There has been too much innocent blood shed for us to just stand there like pacifists.


So let's shed some more like the good warmongers we are!!!

Yippeee...time to destroy the world...

At least then there will be peace...


From: Brighton, UK | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
agent007
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posted 22 December 2001 12:42 PM      Profile for agent007     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
From Mr. Fleming's Profile:
quote:
Occupation: Consultant
Interests: Politics--Professional Dog Handler--Standard Bred Horse Racing

Obviously, Mr. Fleming knows horse-shit.

From: Niagara Falls ON | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
Mohamad Khan
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posted 22 December 2001 12:50 PM      Profile for Mohamad Khan   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Markbo, thanks for voicing your opinion that terrorism is a perversion of Islam--and, i might add, of any religion. i agree with you whole-heartedly.

quote:
Since they will hate us no matter what we do. According to them as long as we remain alive.

this is slightly simplistic. obviously, no one is born a terrorist. terrorists are created by their environment, conditioned by particular myths. in her excellent book, The Battle for God, Karen Armstrong argues that some of the crucial myths sustaining Islamic, Christian and Jewish fundamentalism involve a paranoiac fear of religious extermination, often brought about by the suppression and persecution of individuals and ideas when they are in a much more benign stage of development.

for example, one of the topics she deals with is Shi'i fundamentalism in Iran. she portrays the "secularist experiment" of the Pehlavis as a disaster. some of its institutions, such as the laws that forced Iranians to wear Western clothing and wide-brimmed hats, are laughable, while others, such as SAVAK (the secret police formed with American and Israeli aid) are more grim. "SAVAK's brutal methods, its regime of torture and intimidation, made people feel that they were held prisoner in their own country, with the connivance of Israel and the United States" (246). the fundamentalist form of Shi'ism that Ayatollah Khomeini subsequently espoused could not have been possible without the violence and suppression that preceded it.

while individual fundamentalists may or may not "hate us no matter what we do," it is clear that, at a certain stage of evolution, the individual or society *develops* its hatred for a particular reason. there *is*, then, a stage at which we can curb hatred, and prevent fundamentalists from coming into existence. aggravating factors such as overthrown democracies, stupid laws, state coercion, religious persecution, civilian casualties, genocide, displacement, and "smart bombs" that turn out to be dumb, cannot be extricated from the issues of fundamentalism and hatred.

although WingNut's comment was overly succinct, he/she seems to be pointing out that causes cannot be separated from effects, and i believe that this is an important insight. dismissing it would be fatal to the *real* War on Terrorism.

[ December 22, 2001: Message edited by: Mohamad Khan ]


From: "Glorified Harlem": Morningside Heights, NYC | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
WingNut
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posted 22 December 2001 12:51 PM      Profile for WingNut   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
What this thread fails to recognize is that we are not dealing with peoples religious faiths here. We are dealing with people who have peverted a religion.

I can agree with that markbo. But if we do what Gen. Pershing did (and how many Phillipine civilians did the U.S. purposely slaughter in that country?) and what Mr. Fleming would appear to endorse, what does that make us? Gen. Pershing and anyone who would agree with his methods are pigs too no more deserving than the alleged terrorists.

If we are not civilized, if we do not behave in a civilized manner, and that means we are humanitarians first, then we are of the same character as those we would call terrorists.

What Gen. Pershing is responsible for is barbarity. Is that what you would support?


From: Out There | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
'lance
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posted 22 December 2001 02:12 PM      Profile for 'lance     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Obviously, Mr. Fleming knows horse-shit.

relogged, this is brilliant. If you don't mind, I'll nominate it for the Babble Quotes Hall of Fame.

quote:
Terrorist incidents from Islamic Fundamentalists were unheard of until a decade ago when the U.S. State Department recognized the PLO as legitimate Freedom Fighters.

Mr. Fleming, I'm surprised at you. You begin by celebrating acts of mediaeval cruelty committed by General Pershing, and end by suggesting that It's All The Americans' Fault.

You can't fool us, you crafty devil! I suspect that beneath that neo-con exterior beats the heart of a leftist provocateur.


From: that enchanted place on the top of the Forest | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
Mohamad Khan
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posted 22 December 2001 03:49 PM      Profile for Mohamad Khan   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
You can't fool us, you crafty devil! I suspect that beneath that neo-con exterior beats the heart of a leftist provocateur.

it *is* a really confusing post....


From: "Glorified Harlem": Morningside Heights, NYC | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
'lance
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posted 22 December 2001 07:07 PM      Profile for 'lance     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
On reflection, this is more serious than I thought. I'll quote it at length so Mr. Fleming can't edit it.

quote:
In the years preceding World War I, General Pershing was commander of the American forces in the Philippines. The small Moslem community on the island nation began to wreak havoc against the Philippine government and American forces.
The American troops captured a large group of these terrorists. During the interrogation by the Military Court, the fanatics were heard to repeatedly shout, "Allah Achbar! Allah Achbar! Jihad! The Philippines are the lands of Islam!"

Pershing ordered the Amalekites executed, one by one, in the presence of the whole group.

Now, Moslems will not eat pork believing that no one could enter Paradise if there is even the smallest amount of swine flesh in their bodies. Knowing this, the General first ordered the firing squad to shoot large hogs.

After they skinned the swine, the executioners rolled their bullets in pork fat and passed fat through the barrels of their rifles while the condemned men watched.

As each condemned terrorist was executed, his corpse was wrapped in hog's skin and buried on the spot. The entrails of the swine were dumped over the corpse before the grave was covered. Three of the convicted Amalekites were released to take the news back to their Islamic communities.

That ended the Islamic Jihad in the Philippines. Terrorist incidents from Islamic Fundamentalists were unheard of until a decade ago when the U.S. State Department recognized the PLO as legitimate Freedom Fighters.

Unfortunately the current world crisis with the Palistinians in the Middle East, Moslem and Islamic fundamentalists in Afganistan and Pakistan, we must take some sort of action. Whether the reaction be reflective to that of General Persing or not, something must be done.


He obviously admires Gen. Pershing's methods, claiming that they kept the world free of terrorist incidents perpetrated by Islamic extremists for around 80 years.

Notice, too, how he likes to leave options open. "Whether the reaction be reflective to that of General Persing or not," he writes. He doesn't reject any portion of Gen. Pershing's response in the slightest.


From: that enchanted place on the top of the Forest | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
John I. Fleming
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posted 22 December 2001 07:25 PM      Profile for John I. Fleming        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Lance wrote:

quote:
"Notice, too, how he likes to leave options open. "Whether the reaction be reflective to that of General Persing or not," he writes. He doesn't reject any portion of Gen. Pershing's response in the slightest."

These fundamentalists were condemned to death in the first place. How we go about killing them should have a deterrent effect. As we can see, Islamic and Muslim fundamentalists do not care if they are being put to death because they believe there are 72 virgins waiting for them beside Alah in paradise. If we take that away from them then we will have more of a likelihood of stopping their terrorism. How do we make them believe that they are not going to paradise and in fact are going straight to Hell? As long as they are guilty of crimes that would warrent the death penalty, if it is a lethal injection with the drug mixed with pigs blood, then so be it.

John I. Fleming

[ December 22, 2001: Message edited by: John I. Fleming ]


From: Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
'lance
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posted 22 December 2001 07:32 PM      Profile for 'lance     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
As long as they are guilty of crimes that would warrent the death penalty

I know of no such crimes.


From: that enchanted place on the top of the Forest | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
John I. Fleming
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posted 22 December 2001 07:39 PM      Profile for John I. Fleming        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
You don't consider the slaughter of 3,000 innocent civilians as a crime that would warrent the death penalty? What about Suharto, Hitler, Stalin, etc.?

Should we just slap them on the hand and send them home with a bomb making kit?

John I. Fleming


From: Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
John I. Fleming
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posted 22 December 2001 07:56 PM      Profile for John I. Fleming        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
On this issue of state sanctioned death panalty, let's get something straight here. I may be a Conservative, but not all Conservatives believe in the death penalty. I just so happen to be one of those individuals.

No one can prove that the death penalty in general is a deterrent therefore it's use is only a reaction to retribution. If we can stop an individual from committing an offense through deterrence, then that is the method we should use. In the general population the death penalty does not work therefore it should not be used. Although, in the circumstance of religious zealotry it is a deterrent if used in the fashion General Persing did.

John I. Fleming


From: Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
'lance
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posted 22 December 2001 08:04 PM      Profile for 'lance     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
You don't consider the slaughter of 3,000 innocent civilians as a crime that would warrent the death penalty? What about Suharto, Hitler, Stalin, etc.?
Should we just slap them on the hand and send them home with a bomb making kit?


No, what about them?, and no.

Next set of questions?


From: that enchanted place on the top of the Forest | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
John I. Fleming
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posted 22 December 2001 08:17 PM      Profile for John I. Fleming        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
That is a sad testiment to even a socialist.

If there was ever a need for the death penalty it is to those who committed mass murder on September 11, 2001!

My only suggestion sir, is that you pray to your God that you or your loved ones aren't in the next building or on the next plane. The next time you hug your children, mother, father, sister or brother don't tell them that you wouldn't seek justice if they were killed by a terrorist. I really don't think they would appreciate your tolerance.

John I. Fleming

[ December 22, 2001: Message edited by: John I. Fleming ]


From: Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
'lance
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posted 22 December 2001 09:14 PM      Profile for 'lance     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
That is a sad testiment to even a socialist.

Again with the imputations. Good grief, where do they get this? They surely can't see the red shirt I'm wearing today.

quote:
My only suggestion sir, is that you pray to your God that you or your loved ones aren't in the next building or on the next plane. The next time you hug your children, mother, father, sister or brother don't tell them that you wouldn't seek justice if they were killed by a terrorist.

Personally, I have no God, sir, but thanks for the thought just the same.

Certainly I'd seek justice. Now, what do justice and the death penalty have to do with one another?


From: that enchanted place on the top of the Forest | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
Mohamad Khan
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posted 22 December 2001 09:23 PM      Profile for Mohamad Khan   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
ok...well, now that Mr Fleming has clarified his position, he sounds a lot less reasonable than i had initially imagined...i'll try not to use stronger words, though i'm tempted to. i'm also not going to get involved in the death penalty debate. murderers deserve to be punished; whether it's by death or by other means is an open question.

the scene that Fleming presents in his first post is so obviously the type of *provocation* that creates terrorists that i naturally assumed that he was pointing out the stupidity of General Persing's actions. it didn't even occur to me that he actually *condoned* wrapping corpses in pigskins and dumping entrails into graves as a means of preventing terrorism.

Fleming says that the next time you "hug your children, mother, father, sister or brother don't tell them that you wouldn't seek justice if they were killed by a terrorist". his idea of "justice," apparently, is a lethal injection with pig's blood. and his aim in this is to *deter* terrorists! that is absolutely the most ridiculous thing i have heard on this message board. but...let me try to answer it anyhow.

General Persing was obviously clueless when it came to Islam, and since he lived during the early part of the twentieth century, he can be forgiven to some extent. in the twenty-first century, that kind of ignorance--the ignorance that Fleming seems to espouse--is unacceptable.

Fleming's argument, specifically, is that Islamic terrorism can be deterred by killing terrorists in such a way that undermines the glory of their martyrdom. i won't linger too much on the fact that the methods he describes are Paleolithic in moral terms, and that Persing likely pursued them in response to a Neanderthal, savage instinct rather than any rational stroke of genius. the real problem with this scenario is that Fleming treats Muslim terrorists as primitives for whom mythos reigns over logos. therefore, desecration of Muslim graves with pig organs will cause the other superstitious terrorists to believe that their comrades did not ascend to Paradise, and they will therefore abandon the cause. well, i've got news, for you, man, the fact is that Islamic terrorism is largely an exercise in Western-style logos with only the trappings of religion/mythos, and the idea that they won't find a way to reason their martyrs into heaven is laughable. in fact, i'm sure many would reason that the desecration of their fellow terrorists' graves by the enemy would only hasten the ascent of the dead.

Fleming's strategy of matching Islamic terror with US terror and descending to the level of cavemen is simply not going to work--indeed, that's exactly the kind of blind vengeance that will create more and more Al-Qaidas. as dumb as the present War on Terrorism is, injecting terrorists with pig's blood and rushing to describe it to their compatriots is even more destructive.


From: "Glorified Harlem": Morningside Heights, NYC | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
John I. Fleming
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posted 22 December 2001 09:32 PM      Profile for John I. Fleming        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
"Certainly I'd seek justice. Now, what do justice and the death penalty have to do with one another?"

In this circumstance unfortunately they go hand in hand. If we were to jail them then their fellow fundamentalists would just hijack another plane and demand their release. This has happened before. Israel done the same thing. Unfortunately those same individuals the Israelies released turned around and either bombed them themselves or trained others to do so.

If we don't have some form of deterrence then this will never end. What do you suggest; jailing them? We will only be faced with further terrorist attacks seeking their release.

John I. Fleming

[ December 22, 2001: Message edited by: John I. Fleming ]


From: Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
John I. Fleming
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posted 22 December 2001 09:52 PM      Profile for John I. Fleming        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Mohamad Khan:

I failed to read any recourse you would take.

Shall we build a Berlin Wall around every democracy in the world until the fundamentalists are all dead, their children die of starvation, pestilence and disease ravages their countries? Do we leave them to what they want, what they have been seeking; self autonomy, with no outside interference?

Do we ban all communication with them until they become democratic and respective of human rights?

This approach will not just kill the terrorists, it will kill women and children in the tens of millions, if not hundreds of millions.

What is your solution; let bygones be bygones?

John I. Fleming

[ December 22, 2001: Message edited by: John I. Fleming ]


From: Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
Mohamad Khan
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posted 22 December 2001 10:55 PM      Profile for Mohamad Khan   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Salaam aidan Fleming sahib! kayfa haalak?

i see that, rather than defending your own position, you've chosen to fantasize about my beliefs, and to condemn me based on your own fabrications. however, as astonishing as it is, i may have to change my opinion on you once again...amazingly, you accuse me of wanting to do to "every democracy in the world" what the United States is doing to a particular Middle Eastern country. mubarak howe! this is exactly what i *don't* believe in, and i'm glad that you agree that the kind of treatment being meting out to Iraq is genocidal.

what is my solution? well, Mr Fleming, seeing as i'm a twenty-year old English major, i'm flattered that you would ask such me such a question if you still believe in your initial thesis, i hope that you will continue to defend it so that i may eventually see the glory of the light that errant US bombs bring to Afghani villages and their residents. if, however, you no longer feel that your position is defensible...well, i apologize for treating you as though you were inflexible, and i hope that we can have a discussion regarding more reasonable solutions that won't destroy so many innocent American, Afghani, and Middle Eastern lives.

what do you say?


From: "Glorified Harlem": Morningside Heights, NYC | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
John I. Fleming
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posted 22 December 2001 11:34 PM      Profile for John I. Fleming        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I do not find the current crisis in Iraq as genocidal. It is self inflicted by Saddam Hussien. Iraq is allowed to sell oil for food and medicine yet Mr Hussien believes that military is more important than the health of his people.

As for my solution, I would put up the walls of ignorance to the dictatorships, military governments and communist regimes in this world. That's right, I said ignorance. Ignorance to their plight, ignorance to well being.

No more immigration; no more international aid; no more protection from their neighbours; no nothing.

Let the people fight these tyrants and bring themselves into the world community in peace. But the dictators of foreign nations best be warned that if they attack a member of our community, they will pay the price (Kewait).

John I. Fleming


From: Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
Pankaj
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posted 22 December 2001 11:44 PM      Profile for Pankaj   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Mr Hussien believes that military is more important than the health of his people.

There is another country where this belief is prevalent. Where 53 million persons are without private health insurance and state sponsored health care options. This country has lots of money but it seems not to be enough. How much more wealth creation will be neccessary before all its citizens are treated equally. Hint: Its not Canada.


From: London, ON | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
John I. Fleming
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posted 22 December 2001 11:57 PM      Profile for John I. Fleming        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
There are free clinics in this country you hint at.

John I. Fleming


From: Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
Pankaj
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posted 23 December 2001 12:01 AM      Profile for Pankaj   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
There are people losing their life savings and homes when they become ill, because the free clinics seem not to be enough. Insane to treat a neighbour this way. All in the name of ideology. Good grief.
From: London, ON | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
John I. Fleming
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posted 23 December 2001 12:04 AM      Profile for John I. Fleming        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I don't support this author and his 'solution', but read the first post on this page. He has a solution to "win the war, feed the world, and not a shot is fired."

OK -- here's an innovative solution:

John I. Fleming


From: Sault Ste. Marie, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Nov 2001  |  IP: Logged
Tommy_Paine
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posted 23 December 2001 01:20 AM      Profile for Tommy_Paine     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
As we know, the fundamentalist religious mind is forever maleable.

Christians, Jews and Moslems of all stripes regularly ignore "Thou Shalt not Kill". So, if pig matter was used in the war against Islamic fundamentalists, it wouldn't be long before a fatwah was issued saying pig stuff was not "unclean". (in the religious sense)

Truly, Al Quida has to be rendered incapable of fomenting or commiting acts of terror.

However, to defeat terrorists, a much more thoughtful approach has to be taken in the aftermath.

---

It seems to me the biggest fear some have of Al Quida is that there are hundreds of suicide loving terrorists lurking amoung us.

It would seem to me (surprisingly) that those Al Quida members actually willing to kill themselves in a suicide attack are rarer than what we believe.

It's still questionable even if all the highjackers on the 11th new they were about to become martyrs.

There seems to be a larger population of suicide bombers in Palestine, amoung Hamas. I would contend that this is because the living conditions are such that they spawn such people in greater numbers.

Al Quida, it should be remembered, were recruited from fighters from all over the middle east, from a body of men that might have had more comfortable lives, more established lives, and are therefore less fertile ground for suicide mission recruitment.

The Islamic fundamentalists we are dealing with here like to refer to the west as "Crusaders". They have long memories and hold a grudge, obviously. So, hitting them back harder than they hit us, while it may provide temporary respite, and salve our damaged political face, it does little to "defeat" this enemy.

Their principle weaponry isn't terror.

It's patience.

Something the west has in short supply.


From: The Alley, Behind Montgomery's Tavern | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
NukeMecca
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posted 02 January 2002 02:58 AM      Profile for NukeMecca     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
There are other ways to win this war, after all!
From: Winnipeg | Registered: Dec 2001  |  IP: Logged

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