babble home
rabble.ca - news for the rest of us
today's active topics


Post New Topic  Post A Reply
FAQ | Forum Home
  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» babble   » current events   » national news   » Recession

Email this thread to someone!    
Author Topic: Recession
prince
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 1341

posted 24 September 2001 07:40 AM      Profile for prince     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The business guru's have declared we are now officially in a recession. How long will it last? How does a recession affect you?
From: Ontario | Registered: Sep 2001  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
Moderator
Babbler # 560

posted 24 September 2001 09:18 AM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Well, since I don't own any of those little slips of paper (or should I say electrical impulses in the stock market's computers), it hasn't affected me much yet.
From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 478

posted 24 September 2001 09:26 AM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The housing market in Toronto has been heated for at least the last year -- I assume it's about to fizzle. People who were house-rich but cash-flow poor (pensioners and young families who took on big mortgages) have just become house-poor too, although all those hefty property-tax increases are not coming down. This has happened before -- sigh.
From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Markbo
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 124

posted 24 September 2001 01:29 PM      Profile for Markbo     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I'm really worried about border communities like Windsor, (Without trying to say "my problems are worse than yours because they're mine")

Last year the U.S. government killed a law passed by congress that would require all those entering the U.S. to get a quick visa. That would mean pulling over and entering your name into a computer and how long you would be staying. Then when departing the U.S. you would pull over and check out.

This law would allow the U.S. to keep a list of how many foreigners were in the U.S. without permission.

This law would basically put a wall between Canada and the U.S. due to the hassles and border tie ups that would happen.

Last night 60 minutes did a segment on how terrible it was that this law was not enacted and that it may have prevented this disaster as many as half the terrorists had overstayed their welcome

If we do not cooperate with the U.S. to keep these borders open we could lose hundreds o thousands of jobs in Canada. Personally my retail business has had sales drop in half since the 11th. Downtown Windsor is like a ghost town. The Malls are empty. Casino has already laid off many and cancelled all staff parties. (80% of casino patrons are Americans according to them)

People have to start picking and choosing what they want more, no compromise on sovereignty or JOBS.

You people can argue about your Canadian identity and sovereignty all you want. I'm sure thats whats on the minds of all the existing and potential homeless people.

I'm sure all the people who have already been laid off are right now worrying about not letting the Big Bad U.S. try to tell us how to run our country.

If you really care about child poverty then you will support actions taken to appease the U.S.'s legitimate security concerns so that when they lock the gates, we're on the inside and not the outside.


From: Windsor | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Victor Von Mediaboy
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 554

posted 24 September 2001 01:38 PM      Profile for Victor Von Mediaboy   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
As with all news, with financial news one must consider the source. Not all business gurus are saying we are in a recession. David Dodge says that it's possible we may fall into a recession, but he isn't declaring that we are in one now.

The Conference Board of Canada is saying that the economy will take a hit, but won't go into recession. (Here's their press release. You should kneel before the guy who wrote it. ) In fact, when a CBoC economist went on ROBtv he said that a long war could actually overheat the economy, and cause inflation concerns.

The folks who are most pessimistic are the analysts for the big financial institutions, the brokerage houses in particular. Do they have anything to gain from scaring the public?


From: A thread has merit only if I post to it. So sayeth VVMB! | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Markbo
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 124

posted 24 September 2001 01:48 PM      Profile for Markbo     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I'm not talking about economic statistics. I'm talking about opening up your eyes when you walk into a store and seeing the activity for yourself. Ask a small business owner if they were affected. Look at the layoff numbers in the paper.

You don't need to wait for the economic statistics a month from now to see the potential disaster that cutting ourselves off from the U.S. would cause.

Personally I am still optimistic. I think what may have happened is that we are taking a mild slowdown that may have lasted years and compressing it into one or two quarters. I think the stock market fall might just be the sped up corrections of stock values that would have happened over the next 2-3 years anyways.

I hope and pray I may still be right.


From: Windsor | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 490

posted 24 September 2001 09:38 PM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Markbo, all that law has to do is exempt documented Canadians from the entry/exit visa requirement. Instituting it would increase costs for goods travelling over the border, which is one of the reasons why state senators from bordering states campaigned to drop the legislation (since as originally written it did not exempt Canadians).
From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 490

posted 24 September 2001 09:39 PM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
As for recession affecting me, heh. I'm in school. So I need not worry for at least 7 more months
From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Markbo
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 124

posted 24 September 2001 09:50 PM      Profile for Markbo     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I agree DrC but it scares me that the U.S. Congress did go far enough to pass the law.

ALso, when 60 minutes getting people all riled up doen't bode well for us.

Frankly, I'm a bit scared. If the U.S. chose to increase costs for goods coming across the border it would devastate us and probably help them by lowering their trade deficit.


From: Windsor | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 490

posted 24 September 2001 10:11 PM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Americans would hollar and scream that it is their God-given right to buy cheap stuff and Congress would have to strike down the provision anyway.

In short, the American short-sighted self-interest that I rail against so graphically and loudly actually benefits us, at least in the short term.


From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
machiavellian
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 1365

posted 25 September 2001 06:07 PM      Profile for machiavellian   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
First - a disclaimer - I'm no economist.

Speaking of American short-sighted self-interest, though, thousands of Canadians were already getting laid off due to the US's interference in the soft wood industry - this was prior to the tragedy, and despite the free-trade agreement. As I remember it was basically due to the fact that we were making too much money, and they weren't. The move to increase costs of things crossing their border from Canada had already begun - remember, the States has to be making money, and if they're not, then they'll change the rules regardless. I doubt that going along with all the security sanctions will make much of a difference in preventing that kind of thing from happening.
(Don't get me started on free trade).

I am cheered by the knowledge that if the US essentially cut us off from themselves, they would lose too many vital natural resources that they rely on us for - incl. water, and oil. For eg there's a huge pipeline that was recently built extending from my area here in Northern ALberta all the way to Chicago - cut that off and Chicago is pretty SOL. So I doubt that trade will be significantly interfered with in the long run. As Dr C pointed out, the US also has a lot to lose.

As for a recession - well, mine is a single income household with two small children in it. I just thank God I live up north where homes are affordable, work pays well and you get Northern living allowance...if we still lived in Calgary I think we'd damn near be on welfare, esp. if we are heading into a recession.


From: Peace River (no, not actually in the river, silly) | Registered: Sep 2001  |  IP: Logged
Pimji
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 228

posted 26 September 2001 12:15 AM      Profile for Pimji   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
During the war senario being played out, I doubt the US would ever allow Canada to turn off the oil tap. By this time most of the large resource based companies are owned by US based shareholders.

[ September 26, 2001: Message edited by: Pimji ]


From: South of Ottawa | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Markbo
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 124

posted 26 September 2001 12:16 AM      Profile for Markbo     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Yeah I was deafened when the american public screamed about not getting cheap canadian lumber anymore.

NOTE HUGE AMOUNT OF SARCASM.

Don't be to sure how much they will scream about not being able to buy Canadian products. Many of them will probably figure that only maple syrup, snowshoes and hockey stick prices will change.


From: Windsor | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Markbo
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 124

posted 26 September 2001 12:19 AM      Profile for Markbo     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
During the war senario being played out, I doubt the US would never allow Canada to turn off the oil tap.

Not an issue as oil doesn't stop at customs when passes through the border in the pipeline.

Canada can threaten to withhold oil, but for how long if that is our only source of revenue. It would only take 3-6 months of this new law to effect us before massive unemployment resulted.


From: Windsor | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 490

posted 26 September 2001 12:28 AM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Well, we might as well try charging ourselves the cost of production plus a small markup for oil instead of the standard gouging-price charged by OPEC.

For starters how about unprivatizing Petro-Canada?

Incidentally, we argued this in my economics class - the teacher said that the point I made was rationally valid

(which was that government should take a role in the development of sources of oil as a stable supply and stable pricing of an energy source is fundamental to the smooth operation of our economy as a whole)


From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
WingNut
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 1292

posted 26 September 2001 12:39 AM      Profile for WingNut   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
We are here today in a major urban center in the country of Canada. We are hoping to spot the Patriotus Canuckus. This rare bird is known to habituate this land.

He is described as white and of average intelligence. He has been likened to the avian version of the chameleon.

He is known for his conflicting behaviour.

For example, when his southern cousin, the Patriotus Americanus comes under attack by another bird, he immediately empathises and admires the southern cousins fighting spirit and tenacity.

However, the southern cousin sometimes will make hostile actions towards the Patriotus Canuckus. While admiring the southern cousin, this northern bird will immediately fold prefering to be under the wing of the southern bird rather than displaying any spirit or tenacity of its own.

It can be identified by its ability to fly both north and south simutaneously. As well as, its unigue ability to see only what it wants to see.

Its call is a shrill cacophony that sounds much like this: People have to start picking and choosing what they want more, no compromise on sovereignty or JOBS.

Curiously, this species of bird still exists. This is theorised to be as a result of its close relation and inter-breeding with another northern bird habitating the same area and closely related known as the Independus Canuckus.

[ September 26, 2001: Message edited by: WingNut ]


From: Out There | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
Pimji
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 228

posted 26 September 2001 12:51 AM      Profile for Pimji   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
That is hilarious!

[ September 26, 2001: Message edited by: Pimji ]


From: South of Ottawa | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
JCL
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 1387

posted 26 September 2001 01:19 AM      Profile for JCL     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
What recession? Recession only affects those who don't manage/budget their finances wisely.
From: Winnipeg. 35 days to Christmas yet no snow here. | Registered: Sep 2001  |  IP: Logged
WingNut
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 1292

posted 26 September 2001 01:47 AM      Profile for WingNut   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Thank you for that, JCL.
This is exactly what I have been saying about corporate North America for years. Finally, someone agrees. If those corporate executives could manage their budgets and spending their would be no recession. Ever. They should be hiring welfare mothers as CEO's. Now those women know how to manage money.

From: Out There | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 478

posted 26 September 2001 09:00 AM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
WingNut: Again! Again!
From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged

All times are Pacific Time  

Post New Topic  Post A Reply Close Topic    Move Topic    Delete Topic next oldest topic   next newest topic
Hop To:

Contact Us | rabble.ca | Policy Statement

Copyright 2001-2008 rabble.ca