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Author Topic: Don’t Date Him, Girl!
Pyed Typer
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 12033

posted 16 February 2006 05:47 PM      Profile for Pyed Typer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Don’t go blindly on even a blind date.

Before dating, marrying or otherwise committing check the guy out on the database of cheating men at DONTDATEHIMGIRL.com

[ 16 February 2006: Message edited by: Pyed Typer ]


From: Somewhere ahead of the rats | Registered: Feb 2006  |  IP: Logged
Mr. Magoo
guilty-pleasure
Babbler # 3469

posted 16 February 2006 06:02 PM      Profile for Mr. Magoo   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I think I'll go upload the names and photos of some of my highschool teachers that I didn't like, and some other people who've pissed me off over the years.
From: ø¤°`°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°°¤ø, | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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Babbler # 478

posted 16 February 2006 06:08 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Too funny.

But I would have to register before I asked them about T** ... oh, never mind.


From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
white rabbit
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Babbler # 10751

posted 16 February 2006 06:30 PM      Profile for white rabbit     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
From my experience it is unusual to find a man who is NOT a womanizer.

I was just reading through a website that gives women tips on how to catch a partner who they suspected of cheating. It went into the most incredible minutia of how to snoop through your partner's email files. I had no idea this could be done without someone's knowledge. If someone I lived with did that to me, I would be enraged.

After reading through the material at that site, I'm glad to be single because it must be terrible to be THAT paranoid.

Now I'd like to ask this question: if your spouse / partner cheated on you, would you want to know about it?


From: NS | Registered: Oct 2005  |  IP: Logged
Michael Watkins
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 11256

posted 16 February 2006 06:31 PM      Profile for Michael Watkins   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Mr. Magoo:
I think I'll go upload the names and photos of some of my highschool teachers that I didn't like, and some other people who've pissed me off over the years.

How about adding David Emerson while you are at it... LOL


From: Vancouver Kingway - Democracy In Peril | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
kuri
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Babbler # 4202

posted 16 February 2006 06:36 PM      Profile for kuri   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by white rabbit:
Now I'd like to ask this question: if your spouse / partner cheated on you, would you want to know about it?

Yes. And I'd hopefully hear about it from him before I find out from anywhere else.


From: an employer more progressive than rabble.ca | Registered: Jun 2003  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 478

posted 16 February 2006 06:37 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by white rabbit:

Now I'd like to ask this question: if your spouse / partner cheated on you, would you want to know about it?

Absolutely.

"Cheating" implies that the affair has gone on for some time without one's knowledge. That's what makes it so unendurable. By the time you find out, there has been a double betrayal: the act itself, and then the concealment. Often, the person cheated-upon is the last to learn, which is a hellish situation to be in.

If I were ever in that situation, I would be gone as soon as I knew. Just gone. Life's too short.


From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
The Evil Twin
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Babbler # 11561

posted 16 February 2006 06:44 PM      Profile for The Evil Twin     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
From my experience it is unusual to find a man who is NOT a womanizer.

"Womanizer"? Sounds like a term out of the 50s! The sentence is also completely false since many gay men I know have no interest in "womanizing" whatsoever. OTOH, as a bisexual and having had relationships with BOTH men and women, I can assure you that when it comes to promiscuity, men, women, gay, straight, bi....we all cheat. I'm speaking from personal experience having myself cheated and having been involved with people who were cheating on their spouse/lover.


From: Toronto | Registered: Jan 2006  |  IP: Logged
white rabbit
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posted 16 February 2006 06:45 PM      Profile for white rabbit     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by skdadl:


If I were ever in that situation, I would be gone as soon as I knew. Just gone. Life's too short.


Even if you learned about the affair after it was over?


From: NS | Registered: Oct 2005  |  IP: Logged
Stargazer
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posted 16 February 2006 06:50 PM      Profile for Stargazer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I've taken men back after they have cheated, and honestly, for the most part they simply cheated again - because they could do it and get away with it.

I've also cheated on men, more than once. Of course, when I cheat on them it's always because they deserve it for being such asses. Really, I'm only joking. Okay maybe not so much.

Oh and the snooping through e-mails? Done way more than you would think. It's quite easy actually. Also looking for saved pictures and documents on hard drives - pretty easy.

It's a bad state of affairs when cheating and paranoia are the main ingredients to a relationship.


From: Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist. | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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posted 16 February 2006 06:50 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Yes. I am mean, selfish, and given to insane jealousy.

Ok?


From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
white rabbit
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posted 16 February 2006 06:50 PM      Profile for white rabbit     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by The Evil Twin:

"Womanizer"? Sounds like a term out of the 50s!


I am a 60s grrl. I guess 'infidelity' is even more dated. Whatever, I've yet to be inbolved with a man who didn't screw around. What I find remarkable about men is the way they hook up with another woman so quickly after a split...as if the previous relationship had no meaning at all.


From: NS | Registered: Oct 2005  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
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posted 16 February 2006 06:51 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Dumb site. As Magoo says, it's way too easy to make spurious accusations against innocent people you hate.

This reminds me of those web sites where you upload naked pictures of your ex-girlfriends in order to get revenge on them for leaving you. Nice.


From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Boarsbreath
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posted 16 February 2006 07:00 PM      Profile for Boarsbreath   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I used to be absolutely condemnatory of people who cheat, at least from within a serious relationship. But I didn't marry (ie begin a really serious relationship, which became marriage for the sake of adopting) until my mid-30s.

Now, a lot of exerience with 'cheating' friends later, I've revised my stand, and come up with an Answer to Problems to boot. Don't get married, or the moral equivalent, until you're fairly old. Like mid-30s. Every case of infidelity with which I've sympathised, the relationship had begun in the peoples' 20s...and naturally enough, at least one had changed a lot since then.

Then, once you're properly hitched, I feel free to condemn you. No-one falls for someone else unexpectedly: there's at least a few moments when you know damn well that you can continue or walk away.


From: South Seas, ex Montreal | Registered: Jul 2005  |  IP: Logged
Reality. Bites.
rabble-rouser
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posted 16 February 2006 07:41 PM      Profile for Reality. Bites.        Edit/Delete Post
No listings for my surname, Emerson, Mulroney or Mackay.

I then picked a couple of common surnames. Only two Andersons, eight Smiths, five Joneses.

Only 67 cheaters in all of Canada.

Toronto 6
Montreal 6
Calgary 6
Edmonton 15
Vancouver 1
Winnipeg 0
Halifax 0
Ottawa 2


From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004  |  IP: Logged
shaolin
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posted 16 February 2006 07:57 PM      Profile for shaolin     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Whatever, I've yet to be inbolved with a man who didn't screw around. What I find remarkable about men is the way they hook up with another woman so quickly after a split...as if the previous relationship had no meaning at all.

Loads of women screw around too. It certainly isn't confined to men, and I think we women are taking it up more and more, what with our liberation and all!

As for hooking up with another after a split, well, I'm pretty excellent at that too. It's easier not to think of your newly empty bed when it isn't empty.

Of course, I'll add my usual cavaet: I don't do monogamous relationships. But I also don't cheat anymore.


From: Edinburgh | Registered: Jul 2003  |  IP: Logged
'lance
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posted 16 February 2006 08:01 PM      Profile for 'lance     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Only two Andersons, eight Smiths, five Joneses.

Huh. For once, it's the Joneses who have to keep up.


From: that enchanted place on the top of the Forest | Registered: Jul 2001  |  IP: Logged
Pyed Typer
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Babbler # 12033

posted 16 February 2006 08:31 PM      Profile for Pyed Typer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Oh well, I'm the type of guy who will never settle down.
Where pretty girls are, well you know that I'm around.
I kiss 'em and I love'em 'cause to me they're all the same.
I hug 'em and I squeeze 'em, they don't even know my name.
They call me the wanderer, yeah the wanderer,
I roam around, around, around, around . . .



From: Somewhere ahead of the rats | Registered: Feb 2006  |  IP: Logged
white rabbit
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posted 16 February 2006 08:57 PM      Profile for white rabbit     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Here is the link that tells wives ( I'm not being sexist, the author is directing her advice to a female audience) how to hack into their partner's email files. I was astonished at the detail of these instructions. If I felt I had to go to such lengths to snoop on someone, there would be zero trust in the relationship.

http://divorcesupport.about.com/cs/adultery/a/aa060801a.htm


From: NS | Registered: Oct 2005  |  IP: Logged
Raos
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posted 16 February 2006 09:10 PM      Profile for Raos     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
The article seems to have changed from you claim, white rabbit

quote:
f you suspect that your husband or wife is a cybercheat there are some ways to search for clues in the computer he or she uses. A couple words of caution: if you don't know what you're doing, you could do more harm than good or you could get caught trying to catch your spouse.

I checked the entire first page of three, and either gender neutral terms like spouse were used, or both masculine and feminine terms were used, like "he or she uses".


From: Sweet home Alaberta | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
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posted 16 February 2006 09:11 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I think that once your suspicions are so strong that you're at the stage of trying to hack your spouse's computer with spyware or search his cookies, you already know what you need to know.

And if you have no reason to be suspicious but you're checking "just to make sure" or just out of curiosity, then that is an absolutely gross invasion of privacy. I would leave anyone who even dreamed of invading my privacy in such a manner. In fact, if I were ever to get married again (ha!) I would insist on having my own computer, having had my privacy invaded that way in the past, without reason. There could be all sorts of legitimate (not adulterous) correspondence that a person might want to keep private from their spouse. Just because you marry someone doesn't mean you've given them permission to invade every corner of your mind, soul, and other friendships.


From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
kiwi_chick
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posted 16 February 2006 09:26 PM      Profile for kiwi_chick        Edit/Delete Post
If I had teenagers, I probably want to see what they are doing on the computer. I don't want them to do stuff they would probably regret later. In this case, I think hacking their e-mail accounts, etc would be justified. If my teenage daughter bought a webcam, I don't want her to perform a 'show' for some perv. The things I do for love.

If I was married and my spouse tried to hack my computer, I wouldn't mind cuz I'd like the attention. Lol j/k.


From: ontario | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
kuri
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posted 16 February 2006 09:29 PM      Profile for kuri   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post

From: an employer more progressive than rabble.ca | Registered: Jun 2003  |  IP: Logged
white rabbit
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 10751

posted 16 February 2006 09:42 PM      Profile for white rabbit     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Raos:
The article seems to have changed from you claim, white rabbit

I checked the entire first page of three, and either gender neutral terms like spouse were used, or both masculine and feminine terms were used, like "he or she uses".


My bad. I was reading through the bulk of that writer's material, most of which seemed to be directed toward insecure wives i.e. the stuff about 'telltale signs' of lipstick etc.

It's hard to imagine anyone being so intrusive as to actually follow through on the hacking techniques that are discussed in her article. If a partner of mine did such a thing, I'd turf him out. That's a personal line that you just don't cross no matter how suspicious you are.

Kiwi_Chick I hear what you're saying about the teenage chats. I accidentally stumbled across an icq log a couple of years ago between my son and his teenage friends. My eyes nearly popped out of my head but at the same time I felt terribly guilty for reading it. The thing is, once you start spying on someone, it would become a hard habit to break, especially where a spouse is concerned.

[ 16 February 2006: Message edited by: white rabbit ]


From: NS | Registered: Oct 2005  |  IP: Logged
nonsuch
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Babbler # 1402

posted 17 February 2006 01:56 AM      Profile for nonsuch     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
The thing is, once you start spying on someone, it would become a hard habit to break, especially where a spouse is concerned.

Don't! Just don't, okay?
Infidelity can sometimes be forgiven; spying cannot. The teenagers will never get over it, either, if they find out. Nobody in the history of the world has ever forgiven the person who read their diary. Nobody has ever forgiven the person who steamed open their mail or ransacked their underwear drawer or raided their psychiatrist's files.
Nobody has right to own another person - not even a spouse or a child. Nobody has a right to anyone else's private thoughts. It's not attention; it's not concern; it's not parental duty - it's a form of rape.
So just don't do it!


From: coming and going | Registered: Sep 2001  |  IP: Logged
kuri
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posted 17 February 2006 08:19 AM      Profile for kuri   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by nonesuch:
The teenagers will never get over it, either, if they find out.

I did, actually. Eventually.


From: an employer more progressive than rabble.ca | Registered: Jun 2003  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 478

posted 17 February 2006 08:47 AM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
The mention of reading someone else's diary snapped me to attention too. That has never happened to me, but I've imagined the rage I would feel. And didn't Ann Landers teach us all eons ago that the spying was the worse sin?

Lately I've been reading over a collection of letters. The person who wrote them and the people they were written to have all now died, but some of the stories they tell, one long-running drama especially, are about people still living. It is an odd situation to be in: in a way, I do feel I have intruded in a few lives without permission. I guess that means I have an obligation to keep my mouth shut, which I now proceed to do.


From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Bobolink
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posted 17 February 2006 11:55 AM      Profile for Bobolink   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by white rabbit:
From my experience it is unusual to find a man who is NOT a womanizer.


And just whom are these womanizers womanizing with? Can I post the women who have cheated on me to this list?


From: Stirling, ON | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged
Polly Brandybuck
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posted 17 February 2006 12:09 PM      Profile for Polly Brandybuck     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I know a woman here who went slightly beyond hacking and spying. She suspected her husband of cheating, so she sent him to Edmonton for a polygraph! Twice, in fact. I guess the first one exonerated him so she decided to go back the whole 15 years of their relationship, find out every shitty thing he'd ever done.

I dunno. If I had to send my other half for a lie detector, at that point what's left to save of the relationship?


From: To Infinity...and beyond! | Registered: Dec 2004  |  IP: Logged
CHCMD
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posted 17 February 2006 12:22 PM      Profile for CHCMD   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
I was cleaning out temp files from our computer, 'cause it was running so slow, and came upon all kinds of yucky internet porn - nothing illegal or twisted, just yucky internet porn (the whole genre gives me the creeps).

So I ask my husband, do you use internet porn? And he says no. So he's lying, so now I know he is quite comfortable lying to me. Too bad, 'cause of course now I believe nothing he says. Bummer, but what can you do?


From: 1 | Registered: Aug 2005  |  IP: Logged
white rabbit
rabble-rouser
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posted 17 February 2006 12:30 PM      Profile for white rabbit     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by CHCMD:
I was cleaning out temp files from our computer, 'cause it was running so slow, and came upon all kinds of yucky internet porn - nothing illegal or twisted, just yucky internet porn (the whole genre gives me the creeps).

So I ask my husband, do you use internet porn? And he says no. So he's lying, so now I know he is quite comfortable lying to me. Too bad, 'cause of course now I believe nothing he says. Bummer, but what can you do?


Does anyone else have access to your computer?


From: NS | Registered: Oct 2005  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
Moderator
Babbler # 560

posted 17 February 2006 12:31 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Maybe he lied because he considered that to be something personal that he does, that he doesn't want anyone else to know about, especially people who would consider him "yucky" for doing so. If he hasn't exposed you to it, I don't see what the problem is, unless you're having other problems in your relationship. Lots of people get off on porn, or on "yucky" fantasies they have in their minds, etc. I can see where you'd feel bad about him lying to you about looking at the stuff, but then again, I probably wouldn't tell you about it either if I were him, if I thought you were going to judge me or think I'm "yucky".
From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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posted 17 February 2006 12:35 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
CHCMD: Is it possible that some of that stuff just ... I dunno ... gets into the computer somehow? You know the way pop-ups might?

This worries me, not because I expect anyone else to be using porn on my computer but because I wouldn't want the one other person who ever does work on her to think that I - I mean, innocent I! - was ever, y'know, wasting time that way.


From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
CHCMD
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posted 17 February 2006 12:36 PM      Profile for CHCMD   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by white rabbit:

Does anyone else have access to your computer?


Nope, and the temp files were under his profile


From: 1 | Registered: Aug 2005  |  IP: Logged
CHCMD
rabble-rouser
Babbler # 10246

posted 17 February 2006 12:37 PM      Profile for CHCMD   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Michelle:
Maybe he lied because he considered that to be something personal that he does, that he doesn't want anyone else to know about, especially people who would consider him "yucky" for doing so. If he hasn't exposed you to it, I don't see what the problem is, unless you're having other problems in your relationship. Lots of people get off on porn, or on "yucky" fantasies they have in their minds, etc. I can see where you'd feel bad about him lying to you about looking at the stuff, but then again, I probably wouldn't tell you about it either if I were him, if I thought you were going to judge me or think I'm "yucky".

It's not the porn that bothers me, its the lying. When I saw how easily he lied to me, it really changed something inside me. Feel like I have a little hole somewhere now, hard to explain.


From: 1 | Registered: Aug 2005  |  IP: Logged
Erstwhile
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posted 17 February 2006 12:38 PM      Profile for Erstwhile     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Stargazer:

I've also cheated on men, more than once. Of course, when I cheat on them it's always because they deserve it for being such asses. Really, I'm only joking. Okay maybe not so much.

In all seriousness, I suspect you'll find similar rationalization among damn near everyone who cheats.

"He deserved it - he drove me to it by being an ass."

"She deserved it - she drove me to it by not being caring or supportive enough."

"She deserved it - if she didn't notice I was cheating, she clearly doesn't care enough about me."

I mean, nobody likes feeling like a bad person, right? (This isn't really directed at you, Stargazer; it was your quote that sparked it, is all.)


From: Deepest Darkest Saskabush | Registered: Jan 2004  |  IP: Logged
CHCMD
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posted 17 February 2006 12:41 PM      Profile for CHCMD   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by skdadl:
[QB]CHCMD: Is it possible that some of that stuff just ... I dunno ... gets into the computer somehow? You know the way pop-ups might?

QB]


Nope, all kinds of sites, pictures etc. Under his profile temp files.


From: 1 | Registered: Aug 2005  |  IP: Logged
Mr. Magoo
guilty-pleasure
Babbler # 3469

posted 17 February 2006 12:50 PM      Profile for Mr. Magoo   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
And just whom are these womanizers womanizing with?

Just off the top of my head... women?

I've read (though I have no link) that men and women cheat on their partners in roughly equal proportion.

But some people regard it as a moral no-no (though less of such) to date or sleep with someone you know is married, even if you yourself are single. If we take that to be true then the numbers are even closer to equal, since as you note, an affair-havin' womanizer needs someone to have all those affairs with.


From: ø¤°`°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°°¤ø, | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
rabble-rouser
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posted 17 February 2006 12:54 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by CHCMD:

It's not the porn that bothers me, its the lying. When I saw how easily he lied to me, it really changed something inside me. Feel like I have a little hole somewhere now, hard to explain.


Maybe it's because I'm old; maybe it's a sign I'm conservative ... I dunno. But I really get that reaction. It would be mine too.

People are different, and I'm sure that lots of people could live with kinds of relationships I couldn't. To be truthful, there are hardly any relationships I can live with, so there you go.

But that matters. For some of us, it just wouldn't work to think there were large spaces of the great unknown between us and the lover. For others, that would be cool. And that's all cool.

What isn't cool is that one partner should feel she must suppress her own gut reactions to the other partner's notions of how much private space is privileged. There's nothing wrong with being shocked to discover there's that much difference between your notions of private space. And no one should feel forced to give up her own sense of the closeness - or the space - she needs.


From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
pookie
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posted 17 February 2006 12:57 PM      Profile for pookie     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by CHCMD:

It's not the porn that bothers me, its the lying. When I saw how easily he lied to me, it really changed something inside me. Feel like I have a little hole somewhere now, hard to explain.


I can understand that. It's like, all of a sudden there's this unknown element.

On the other hand, don't most people engage in some lying, even to intimate partners? Particularly with regard to things they are embarrassed about, or don't think is a big deal.


From: there's no "there" there | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
josh
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posted 17 February 2006 01:03 PM      Profile for josh     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:

It's not the porn that bothers me, its the lying.

Oh please. That's the first inclination out of sheer embarassment, or a feeling that your private space has been invaded. And it obviously is the porn to some degree, otherwise you wouldn't have asked.


From: the twilight zone between the U.S. and Canada | Registered: Aug 2002  |  IP: Logged
anne cameron
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posted 17 February 2006 01:06 PM      Profile for anne cameron     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
When I found out my ex was pole vaulting into someone else's bed I felt as if my entire midsection had been emptied. Couldn't eat, couldn't even talk, for days.

Then I found out he had a long history of such...
and
CLICK!

I didn't care. I flat out did not give a hoot.

Of course, from then on I didn't give a hoot about HIM, either and in no time flat he was out the door, his stuff got packed and shipped to him collect (Scotch to the end!), and for five thousand dollars I got my divorce.

I don't know why people cheat. Maybe there's some kind of thrill, like swiping corn from a farmers field or..>>???


From: tahsis, british columbia | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged
CHCMD
rabble-rouser
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posted 17 February 2006 01:06 PM      Profile for CHCMD   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by pookie:

On the other hand, don't most people engage in some lying, even to intimate partners? Particularly with regard to things they are embarrassed about, or don't think is a big deal.


Dunno, I haven't felt the need to lie to him about anything (yet anyways). I really thought that part of the foundation of our relationship was trust, and now that's gone. 'Cause how do I know what is a lie and what isn't? So I guess there is a big old crack in the foundation so-to-speak. I feel distant, kind of disconnected. Weird. I am working on just letting it go (stuffing it down?). Life is not perfect or fair, nor should I expect it to be so. I'm sure (I hope) it won't take too long to shrug it off and just get on with life.


From: 1 | Registered: Aug 2005  |  IP: Logged
CHCMD
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posted 17 February 2006 01:08 PM      Profile for CHCMD   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by josh:

Oh please. That's the first inclination out of sheer embarassment, or a feeling that your private space has been invaded. And it obviously is the porn to some degree, otherwise you wouldn't have asked.


Thanks josh, I appreciate your feedback.


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Cueball
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posted 17 February 2006 01:13 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by CHCMD:

Thanks josh, I appreciate your feedback.



Actually just to be a little helpful here, pictures from any web site visited is stored in the Temp Folder. This means that were your husband (?) to click through to spammed e-mail with links to porn sites, those images would show up in the Temp Folder, wether or not your husband intended to link through or not.

Porn site web masters have developed all kinds of systems by which multiple pop-ups spring into action everytime someone tries to close a page, and other tricks designed to sell their product. So the appearance of porn pictures in the Temp Folder could be entirely accidental.


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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posted 17 February 2006 01:15 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
That was sort of what I was asking, Cue.

And josh, really: Do you own CHC's feelings?


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Michelle
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posted 17 February 2006 01:17 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
In the situation described by CHCMD, it seems to me that the first person to lie was the one who invaded someone's privacy. First, looking through the cookies, which, okay, I can believe (maybe) it was an honest mistaken discovery. But that's when the lying, at least by omission began. Without telling him she'd invaded his privacy in such a manner, she then asked him, "Do you look at porn online?" To me, that's a dumping offense right there. Entrapment has no place in a relationship, especially when it comes to invading someone's thoughts without their permission - and I'm sorry, but checking internet surfing history is, to me, spying on a person's very thoughts, because most of us surf based on what we're thinking about or wanting to think about. If he doesn't want to tell you what he's thinking about then it's NOYFB.

I had a partner once who was constantly spying on me and trying to catch me lying to him by setting me up. And the funny thing was, I was almost always truthful with him, and the only lying I ever did was by omission if even that. I felt guilty if I didn't share everything with him, which seems dumb to me now, but at the time that's how I felt.

Having had that experience, my privacy is now so important to me that if I found out someone was deliberately going out of his way to spy on me, and then using what he learns to set me up (even if what he uses to set me up is something he's discovered by accident), or to interrogate me, it would just make me shut down emotionally. I like to think that I'd dump his ass so fast I'd be gone before it hits the ground.


From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Reality. Bites.
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posted 17 February 2006 01:18 PM      Profile for Reality. Bites.        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by CHCMD:
It's not the porn that bothers me, its the lying. When I saw how easily he lied to me, it really changed something inside me. Feel like I have a little hole somewhere now, hard to explain.

Why did you ask him a question when you already knew the answer and had undoubtedly already conveyed the message to him that he'd be better off lying?

The apppropriate answer, in my opinion, would have been "None of your damn business." Would that have made you feel better?


From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004  |  IP: Logged
Erstwhile
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posted 17 February 2006 01:18 PM      Profile for Erstwhile     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by anne cameron:

I don't know why people cheat. Maybe there's some kind of thrill, like swiping corn from a farmers field or..>>???

I'm sure that's the case for some. For others I suspect it's that they're unhappy in their relationship, but don't have the confidence to address what's making them unhappy, the insight to know what's making them unhappy, or the guts to end the relationship.

And I can think of one relationship in particular (not one I was involved in, thank Gord) where I'm pretty sure it was a dominance thing on the husband's part...kind of a "I will cheat, and you won't leave me, because I'm in charge and you should know your place". Terrible, terrible relationship, from what I could tell - not physically abusive, thankfully, and the wife finally did leave him, also thankfully.

EDITed out stuff that was probably TMI.

[ 17 February 2006: Message edited by: Erstwhile ]


From: Deepest Darkest Saskabush | Registered: Jan 2004  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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posted 17 February 2006 01:19 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by pookie:

On the other hand, don't most people engage in some lying, even to intimate partners? Particularly with regard to things they are embarrassed about, or don't think is a big deal.

In my experience, if you don't want to settle for that, you don't have to.

I accept that many people don't think of that as "settling," and that's fine. But some people do swallow that kind of arrangement because they feel it is inevitable and they must. I don't think that is true.

We should all trust our nerves, and no one else can tell us what our nerves are saying.


From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
chester the prairie shark
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posted 17 February 2006 01:20 PM      Profile for chester the prairie shark     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by housemouse:
I know a woman here who went slightly beyond hacking and spying. She suspected her husband of cheating, so she sent him to Edmonton for a polygraph! Twice, in fact. I guess the first one exonerated him so she decided to go back the whole 15 years of their relationship, find out every shitty thing he'd ever done.

I dunno. If I had to send my other half for a lie detector, at that point what's left to save of the relationship?


or how about if my other half was insisting i take a polygraph..."that'll be about enough of that, thank you, oh and goodbye"


From: Saskatoon | Registered: Sep 2004  |  IP: Logged
S1m0n
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posted 17 February 2006 01:20 PM      Profile for S1m0n        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by CHCMD:

It's not the porn that bothers me, its the lying. When I saw how easily he lied to me, it really changed something inside me. Feel like I have a little hole somewhere now, hard to explain.


So you want him to tell you when the pants make your ass look fat?


From: Vancouver | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 17 February 2006 01:21 PM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Michelle:

Having had that experience, my privacy is now so important to me that if I found out someone was deliberately going out of his way to spy on me, and then using what he learns to set me up (even if what he uses to set me up is something he's discovered by accident), or to interrogate me, it would just make me shut down emotionally. I like to think that I'd dump his ass so fast I'd be gone before it hits the ground.


I had a situation where my girlfriends ex boyfriend was reading her e-mail, and then using the information he found there to try and convince her he had ESP.


From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
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posted 17 February 2006 01:22 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by RealityBites:
Why did you ask him a question when you already knew the answer and had undoubtedly already conveyed the message to him that he'd be better off lying?

Exactly. I'd have lied too. Or, actually, more likely these days, being older and wiser, I'd have done this:

quote:
he apppropriate answer, in my opinion, would have been "None of your damn business."

From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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posted 17 February 2006 01:23 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by RealityBites:

Why did you ask him a question when you already knew the answer and had undoubtedly already conveyed the message to him that he'd be better off lying?

The apppropriate answer, in my opinion, would have been "None of your damn business." Would that have made you feel better?


Maybe she was shocked and said the first thing that came to her as a sincere feeling? Maybe she was honest?


From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
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posted 17 February 2006 01:26 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Oh please. It sounds like a classic set up, from what we've been told here.

An HONEST first reaction would be, "I just found a bunch of porn in the temporary directory of the computer when I was cleaning out the cookies, and I know I haven't been surfing any porn sites. Do you look at online porn?"

[ 17 February 2006: Message edited by: Michelle ]


From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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posted 17 February 2006 01:26 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I don't get this.

Some people seem to think there are right and wrong ways to feel about relationships, correct and incorrect ways to respond to surprises that ambush you because you didn't think things were working that way and suddenly you discover they are.

Nonsense. If you feel ambushed, you have been. And no one can tell you any different.


From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
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posted 17 February 2006 01:28 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Yeah, well, I'm just telling you that I would feel (and have felt) ambushed by the type of approach CHCMD describes in this thread. I have just as much right to my own reactions as you and she have to yours.
From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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posted 17 February 2006 01:28 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Of course you do, Michelle. That has been my whole point.
From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
CHCMD
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posted 17 February 2006 01:28 PM      Profile for CHCMD   Author's Homepage        Edit/Delete Post
Thanks to all for your varied opinions, I appreciate that you took the time to share them with me. I could reply to the negative, but I choose to just thank those who provided support. I know this is really not the place to discuss personal stuff (with strangers), but I have no one to talk to about it.

I won't be posting any more. It's just too upsetting. I am crying harder now than I have since it happened. Obviously this was not such a good idea.

My apologies for airing my dirty laundry.

Regards


From: 1 | Registered: Aug 2005  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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posted 17 February 2006 01:30 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Aw, my love.

I'll PM. We've all been ... well, not there, not ever quite where you are, but somewhere similar.

Damn. Now I'm crying too. Hang in there, chick.


From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
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posted 17 February 2006 01:34 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I'm sorry, CHCMD. I guess we were harsh. In my defense, I have my own baggage that I've brought to this, and it makes my stomach clench to think about people searching my computer since I have so much correspondence and personal stuff in it, stuff that I would never want anyone to look through. And especially since that's the very way I've felt betrayed in the past. So it hit me kind of hard too. (To the point where I'm posting during the day even though I normally don't do that!)

I feel bad that you regret posting what you did. I can also understand you feeling shocked to discover that your husband does something you find distasteful and then lied to you about it. I hope you can resolve things with him.


From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Reality. Bites.
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posted 17 February 2006 01:39 PM      Profile for Reality. Bites.        Edit/Delete Post
In my experience porn is pretty much like masturbation - there are men who look at porn and are honest about it, and men who look at porn and are dishonest about it.

[ 17 February 2006: Message edited by: RealityBites ]


From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004  |  IP: Logged
Scout
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posted 17 February 2006 02:12 PM      Profile for Scout     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by S1m0n:

So you want him to tell you when the pants make your ass look fat?


What a shitty sexist post!

This is a rotten thread and it needs to be closed.


From: Toronto, ON Canada | Registered: Oct 2001  |  IP: Logged
deBeauxOs
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posted 17 February 2006 02:15 PM      Profile for deBeauxOs     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
posted by anne cameron: ... and for five thousand dollars I got my divorce. ...
Holy Moly!!! why so expensive?

From: missing in action | Registered: Aug 2005  |  IP: Logged
skeptikool
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posted 17 February 2006 02:29 PM      Profile for skeptikool        Edit/Delete Post
Very easy to add a cheater. But what of the vindictive smear? (is there any other kind?)

Quite 1984-ish. Big Sister is watching you.


From: Delta BC | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
S1m0n
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posted 17 February 2006 03:26 PM      Profile for S1m0n        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by CHCMD:

I won't be posting any more. It's just too upsetting. I am crying harder now than I have since it happened. Obviously this was not such a good idea.

You know, this is the most common form of "snoop's karma". It's revealing that the poster DIDN'T see snooping her partner's computer as dishonest, and didn't see concealing the fact that she'd been doing so while asking a setup question as also dishonest.

Well, when this is what you do, yo have to live with the consequences. A damaged relationship and the rotten feeling in the pit of your stomach are the commonest consequences. This is a mistake we all make, in my experiencew. I've certainly made it, so I'm certainly not judging. However, when I realized what I'd done, I vowed to never do that again. And I haven't. I don't snoop people's stuff any longer, and I ask direct, honest questions when I need something cleared up.

~~

However, in this specific circumstance, I think you might need to try and understand your partner's reflexes.

Men and boys are trained to be ashamed of pron and masturbation, and in some flavours of feminism is considered pretty uncool. It's an area in which people's reflex, most of the time, is to conceal.

I'm not sure which areas of your life are analogous, but we all have secrets--that's human nature.


From: Vancouver | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
Bacchus
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posted 17 February 2006 03:31 PM      Profile for Bacchus     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Maybe she was shocked and said the first thing that came to her as a sincere feeling?

Possible his reaction was exactly the same as this


From: n/a | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
fern hill
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Babbler # 3582

posted 17 February 2006 03:41 PM      Profile for fern hill        Edit/Delete Post
Come on, guys, let's cut CHCMD some slack. She's just had an upsetting experience.

quote:
Originally posted by S1m0n:

You know, this is the most common form of "snoop's karma". It's revealing that the poster DIDN'T see snooping her partner's computer as dishonest, and didn't see concealing the fact that she'd been doing so while asking a setup question as also dishonest.

I didn't read her post as 'snooping'; she was clearing away some crap. And it doesn't sound like it was her partner's computer, but one that they both use. Why didn't the partner clear out the crap? If not to avoid the situation that did occur, then maybe just to save CHCMD's feelings.

My sweetie and I don't live together and I often use his computer. Once I was looking for a site and hit 'History'. While it was coming up, I suddenly thought, 'Oh shit, what if there's something there I'd rather not know about?' There wasn't, but I haven't done it again.


From: away | Registered: Jan 2003  |  IP: Logged
S1m0n
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Babbler # 11427

posted 17 February 2006 03:52 PM      Profile for S1m0n        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by fern hill:
Come on, guys, let's cut CHCMD some slack. She's just had an upsetting experience.

My post might be coming across with less empathy than I intend, because I've been in her position and I know what it feels like.

But her accidental discovery became snooping when she concealed what she'd done and asked leading questions about it. For sure, that's how her partner would see it.

[ 17 February 2006: Message edited by: S1m0n ]


From: Vancouver | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
kuri
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posted 17 February 2006 04:08 PM      Profile for kuri   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
What a horrible, ugly thread this has turned into. CHCMD, I hope you will continue to post here. You didn't deserve the treatment you received in this thread.
From: an employer more progressive than rabble.ca | Registered: Jun 2003  |  IP: Logged
Reality. Bites.
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Babbler # 6718

posted 17 February 2006 04:26 PM      Profile for Reality. Bites.        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by kurichina:
You didn't deserve the treatment you received in this thread.

Her husband deserved it even less - and had no choice about his participation.


From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004  |  IP: Logged
Mr. Magoo
guilty-pleasure
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posted 17 February 2006 04:26 PM      Profile for Mr. Magoo   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
I didn't read her post as 'snooping'; she was clearing away some crap.

I don't mean this as an accusation targetting anyone, but in IE you clear away the crap by clicking on Tools - Internet Options - Delete Files.

It doesn't show you the files you're deleting, and since there are bound to be thousands, if not tens of thousands, most of which are little page borders and bullets and other junk, most people don't bother looking.

In Mozilla it's similar. You click on a button to clear your cache. You don't see the files.


From: ø¤°`°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°°¤ø, | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged
deBeauxOs
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posted 17 February 2006 04:37 PM      Profile for deBeauxOs     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
It also appears that the nature of his particular secret activity carries a lot of emotional charge.

Years ago, I lived with a man who was bulemic, and ashamed of it. His weakness was candy bars and potato chips. I suspected that he 'snacked' on junk food because I would make tasty & healthy meals and he would only eat a bit - and no, it was not tofu scramble and raw veggies, more like low-fat lasagna and meat dishes. When I challenged him about his eating habits, he lied about it.

We kept in touch through mutual acquaintances. Recently I found out that he was diagnosed with diabetes and cardiac problems. He was prescribed a strict healthy diet and now looks considerably healthier. But he was a junk food junkie and even though society back then did not view this addiction or indulgence as bad he could not be honest about it.


From: missing in action | Registered: Aug 2005  |  IP: Logged
Pyed Typer
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posted 17 February 2006 04:45 PM      Profile for Pyed Typer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
What anybody has on their computer is not necessarily the result of that operator’s actions.

quote:
Originally posted by Cueball:
. . . Porn site web masters have developed all kinds of systems . . . So the appearance of porn pictures in the Temp Folder could be entirely accidental.

That could also be the result of auto dial-up malware.

In the case of the History file, the computer might be suffering from a browser hijack virus like the Blaster worm.

I experienced something like that. Until I finally tracked it all down and deleted the files by hand (neither virus or spyware security protected me, neither would it flush the worm from my system) anybody reading my History would have found quite a number of sites listed that I never intended to visit.

In my case, none of the redirects took me to porn sites, (rather to a “registry cleaning” and “system optimizer” software distributer) but porn sites use redirects, too.

quote:
Originally posted by CHCMD:
. . . So I ask my husband, do you use internet porn? And he says no. So he's lying . . .

Years ago, when I was on dial-up, I accidentally caught an auto dialler that tried to dial up a porn site and download a large file of porn, along with a bill for the “service.” Due only to the way I had my modem configured, I intercepted the download before it had completed, and disconnected.

I had to stay off-line until I had found and deleted all copies (Mine had at least one hidden file which replicated the file that actually did the dialling.) It was tricky, and took me a couple of days.

Had it succeeded, I might have unknowingly had a large file of porn on my computer, until the bill for my “Membership” showed up.


I’m not claiming anyone's instincts are wrong -- if you are certain the person involved is into porn, you probably have other reasons for believing that so readily -- but, on a purely objective level, merely finding porn on a computer does not necessarily mean that the operator deliberately put it there.

quote:
Originally posted by CHCMD:
I was cleaning out temp files from our computer. . .

It was the mention that the computer was running slow that initially twigged me to the possibility that CHCMD might also be experiencing a bug or spyware.

The amount of files don't slow a computer down (unless it need defraging badly ). A slowdown is often the cue that your system has parasites.


Finally, nothing in this post should be construed as agreement, or disagreement, with other people’s instincts.

I am constantly being surprised by what people do, but I have been online for a decade, and have learned many of the pitfalls, usually by falling into the pit at least once or twice.

[ 17 February 2006: Message edited by: Pyed Typer ]


From: Somewhere ahead of the rats | Registered: Feb 2006  |  IP: Logged
Andy (Andrew)
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posted 17 February 2006 05:49 PM      Profile for Andy (Andrew)   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
CHCMD has a right to want to have the same values as her husband about those things. If he thinks it's an unrealistic standard maybe not agree?

CHCMD was not snooping, she was using a shared computer. Real different from spying.

I wouldn't be upset as she is about porn but I wouldn't like lying.

Can we stop picking at her?


From: Alberta | Registered: Nov 2005  |  IP: Logged
v michel
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posted 17 February 2006 06:09 PM      Profile for v michel     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by CHCMD:

It's not the porn that bothers me, its the lying. When I saw how easily he lied to me, it really changed something inside me. Feel like I have a little hole somewhere now, hard to explain.


I feel you, CHCMD. It's terrifying the first time someone lies to you and you know that they are lying. The ease with which someone close can say something untrue... it does change things. It's something you didn't know they could do.

When you share things, you get into other people's business without meaning to sometimes. I can't tell you how many times I've been on autopilot and opened someone's mail, or read an e-mail, before even realizing what I was doing. Of course I stop and apologize once I realized what happened. But I've always been envious of, and curious about, people who manage to keep such things separate. I'd actually like to experience that, just for the sake of order, but it never works out that way. You share a computer, you see each other's junk.

I guess that's why you got to talk things out. So when someone asks "do you look at pron?" you can say "If I say yes, you will judge me, so that's a crappy question and I don't want to answer it." Then you have something to chew on together, and good things might come out of it.

ETA: curious about people who manage to keep such things separate and also have a healthy, happy relationship without being tired and overwhelmed trying to keep things separated. I know how to keep things separate physically, but not how to maintain that without just getting fed up at the bother...

[ 17 February 2006: Message edited by: vmichel ]


From: a protected valley in the middle of nothing | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged
cogito ergo sum
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posted 17 February 2006 06:21 PM      Profile for cogito ergo sum     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by kiwi_chick:
If I had teenagers, I probably want to see what they are doing on the computer. I don't want them to do stuff they would probably regret later. In this case, I think hacking their e-mail accounts, etc would be justified. If my teenage daughter bought a webcam, I don't want her to perform a 'show' for some perv. The things I do for love.

If I was married and my spouse tried to hack my computer, I wouldn't mind cuz I'd like the attention. Lol j/k.



I hope you're kidding about the spying on teenagers part too. Anyone's kids deserve the same amount of respect and privacy as other adults in the relationship. The idea that it's okay to snoop through your kids' stuff is despicable. The idea that it's okay to do so but it's not okay to do it to an adult is even more despicable.

From: not behind you, honest! | Registered: Oct 2005  |  IP: Logged
kuri
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posted 17 February 2006 06:34 PM      Profile for kuri   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by RealityBites:

Her husband deserved it even less - and had no choice about his participation.


Do you mean his participation in the thread? Because he isn't identified by name, and if we weren't allowed to relate personal stories our participation on babble would be seriously curtailed.

As for what happened between her and her husband, well our own relationships necessarily have to be conducted according to our own comfort limits. If she isn't comfortable with porn on a shared computer, either her and her partner should have separate computers (my solution to the problem) or it should be eliminated. She shouldn't have to be confronted with it. That's a very traumatic experience.

[ 17 February 2006: Message edited by: kurichina ]


From: an employer more progressive than rabble.ca | Registered: Jun 2003  |  IP: Logged
kuri
rabble-rouser
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posted 17 February 2006 06:41 PM      Profile for kuri   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Double post.

[ 17 February 2006: Message edited by: kurichina ]


From: an employer more progressive than rabble.ca | Registered: Jun 2003  |  IP: Logged
anne cameron
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posted 17 February 2006 07:08 PM      Profile for anne cameron     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Why did it cost me so much to get the divorce? Hey, this was twentyfive years ago when five thou was real money! It cost that because Peter Pan, the little boy who refused to grow up, would not co-operate in any way and we were actually in court THREE times...he didn't show up or send a lawyer any of the three times but the judge finally got fed up, and handed down the divorce. The first time the damned judge asked ME why PP wasn't there. And the walking mouth here replied that I didn't know, I wasn't his mother, and I was there. (advice..don't say that to a judge!!). Yep, five thou "and cheap at twice the price"!!!!!!!!!!!! Things have changed since then, you don't have to prove adultery, etc., but I came away from the whole stinkin' mess knowing why so many women my age or older stayed in septic relationships. You had to practically declare war and have some $$$ just to get in front of the beak, and for many women neither of those things was available.

As for cleaning the computer. I don't touch this beast, technology and I detest each other so my son gives it a "D&C" (dusting and cleaning) every month or so. And three days ago he came into the kitchen where his wife and I were having tea and the look on his face..well, I won't soon forget it. He said "mom, can you come here a minute?", then asked "who else is using your computer?", I said just me, you, and Ag and he said well, shit, mom, excuse my french but..here, LOOK at the stuff here... Listen, I could not believe what was waiting to be deleted. Music sites I'd never even heard of were among the least offensive. Porn sites about fat women, about asian women, about...and I haven't a clue how any of that happened or what it piggybacked in on or...but it's gone, now, although from watching CSI I'm sure Homeland Security could find it on my hidden hard drive and charge me with some nefarious thing.

Amazing how so many people were ready to jump on someone for asking (or blurting out) a question about crap in the computer. I can only hope that when your world has been shaken to the core you're able to stay calm, rational, and ever so detached and dispassionate as to be able to first carefully examine the connotations of every word you use before you speak from your place of shock and grief.


From: tahsis, british columbia | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged
kiwi_chick
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posted 17 February 2006 08:23 PM      Profile for kiwi_chick        Edit/Delete Post
Thank God you didn't marry this guy.

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/0217062contract1.html?link=rssfeed


From: ontario | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
kuri
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posted 17 February 2006 08:58 PM      Profile for kuri   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Good god, kiwi_chick... did that woman actually sign that thing? Was she drugged?
From: an employer more progressive than rabble.ca | Registered: Jun 2003  |  IP: Logged
Raos
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posted 17 February 2006 09:00 PM      Profile for Raos     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
kiwi_chick, that is absolutely unbelievable. Utterly incomprehensible. The absolute insanity in that link is literally beyond the bounds of anything I've ever read in my life. How can anybody even for a second even think that they have the right to control somebody else to anywhere NEAR such a degree?
From: Sweet home Alaberta | Registered: May 2004  |  IP: Logged
Mr. Magoo
guilty-pleasure
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posted 17 February 2006 09:47 PM      Profile for Mr. Magoo   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
The illuminated lettering on that contract was nice though.
From: ø¤°`°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°°¤ø, | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged
kiwi_chick
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posted 17 February 2006 10:57 PM      Profile for kiwi_chick        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
A copy of the proposed contract, which Frey's wife never signed and later provided to cops, can be found below

I guess she didn't. Good for her.

quote:
Frey is already charged with first-degree kidnapping, which is a crime punishable by life in prison without parole. Frey also faces a charge of domestic assault causing bodily injury on his wife.


Apparently, he downloaded child porn too.

linky:
http://www.nbc4.tv/family/6812175/detail.html

He's gonna rot in jail.


From: ontario | Registered: Dec 2005  |  IP: Logged
DrConway
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posted 18 February 2006 07:19 PM      Profile for DrConway     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
He's due to bond out until trial some time next week though. My brain almost imploded reading the "contract". It was that painful to look at.
From: You shall not side with the great against the powerless. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
nonsuch
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posted 19 February 2006 04:20 AM      Profile for nonsuch     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
(Hello, Dr. Conway; long time, etc.)

Seems to me, spying vs lying is a serious issue in relationships. Not banter material so much as a subject for body and soul. ?


From: coming and going | Registered: Sep 2001  |  IP: Logged
Pyed Typer
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posted 19 February 2006 10:44 AM      Profile for Pyed Typer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
And then there is cybernetic trust.


Sweet Microchip Love
Emily Mathieu
Feb. 14, 2006

quote:
The chips allow the couple to open each other's front doors and log onto their computers. Graafstra and Tomblin are on each other's "approved list." That means the programs protecting their stuff are designed to recognize each others implants.


[ 19 February 2006: Message edited by: Pyed Typer ]


From: Somewhere ahead of the rats | Registered: Feb 2006  |  IP: Logged
Cueball
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posted 19 February 2006 10:54 AM      Profile for Cueball   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Gawd!
From: Out from under the bridge and out for a stroll | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Stargazer
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posted 19 February 2006 11:11 AM      Profile for Stargazer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
mean, nobody likes feeling like a bad person, right? (This isn't really directed at you, Stargazer; it was your quote that sparked it, is all.)

hey no offense taken. You're actually 100 percent correct re: motives.

And the porn thing? Gosh, spare me the poor guy victim crap. I would not be even remotely happy to find out my date/husband/what have you was into a weird and freakish sort of porn I found offensive. I don't think I'd have a whole lot of issues with tame shit but what if this was brutal rape porn etc. I say if you find that shit that guy is up for a lot of talking to (and better yet - ditching). And contrary to popular belief, if you know anything about computers all you need to do to accidentally discover the porn habit is to go to the Recent documents and there you have it. Or notice that your browser has been hijacked from all the porn viewing.

There has to be a line. And that line is whatever the person is and can be comfortable with. If the guy is so addicted to his, let's say offensive, porn then maybe he doesn't need a girlfriend. Seriously, I am super suspicious of this type of shit. The last thing you want to find out is that the guy you are falling in love with has some really nasty porn likes.


From: Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist. | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
kuri
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posted 19 February 2006 11:32 AM      Profile for kuri   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Stargazer:
There has to be a line. And that line is whatever the person is and can be comfortable with.

So perfectly put.


From: an employer more progressive than rabble.ca | Registered: Jun 2003  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
Moderator
Babbler # 560

posted 19 February 2006 11:36 AM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Stargazer:
I would not be even remotely happy to find out my date/husband/what have you was into a weird and freakish sort of porn I found offensive.
...
Seriously, I am super suspicious of this type of shit. The last thing you want to find out is that the guy you are falling in love with has some really nasty porn likes.

I agree with you, Stargazer, but in this case, we weren't talking about brutal or freakish porn. She said in her post straight out that it wasn't illegal or twisted or anything, just "yucky", which she then said she considers all porn to be. Which is fine, no one's saying anyone has to like porn. But just so we're clear that the reactions on this thread weren't about a guy who is into watch-mom-and-I-screw-a-billy-goat stuff or anything.


From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
jeff house
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posted 19 February 2006 02:32 PM      Profile for jeff house     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I have had the negative experience of being given the Third Degree in interrogation because of entirely innocent stuff on the computer.

This was a few years ago, but my friend discovered that I was visiting a site called "hotmail" (obviously a porn site, she thought), and not only that, she discovered that I had made it impossible for her to visit that site, because I had made it accessible only for those who knew a "password".

She thought I was hiding terrible secrets.

Generally, I think it is best that people rely on tried-and-true methods of getting to know one another, and not rifle through correspondence or even sites visited on the computer. I am confident I can understand the personality of anyone by talking with them, socializing, etc, and not looking for hidden clues which may never be expressed in real life.


From: toronto | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Reality. Bites.
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posted 19 February 2006 02:36 PM      Profile for Reality. Bites.        Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Stargazer:
And the porn thing? Gosh, spare me the poor guy victim crap.

How about you spare us the "woman good, man bad" crap instead? How dare you pretend the victim is the aggressor just because he's male and like porn. Where the fuck do you get off? And where do you get off bringing in crap about "brutal rape porn" when you know perfectly well that isn't at all what's being discussed here. I'm surprised you didn't try to smear him with kiddy porn too while you were at it.


From: Gone for good | Registered: Aug 2004  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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posted 19 February 2006 02:40 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by jeff house:
I am confident I can understand the personality of anyone by talking with them, socializing, etc, and not looking for hidden clues which may never be expressed in real life.

Silly boy.


From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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Babbler # 478

posted 19 February 2006 02:43 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
RB: Is this fight really necessary?

We all know that there are major differences of opinion here, and they speak to profoundly different sensibilities. Could we stop hurting one another? Please?


From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Stargazer
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posted 19 February 2006 03:31 PM      Profile for Stargazer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
RB, if you read my post, I was specifically referring to the brutal rape porn stuff, not the tame porn. Really.

I'm sorry but I have zero sympathy for the twisted screws who enjoy that, and you wouldn't either if you were on the end of one of those brutal rapes. Not a very fucking funny thing eh, brutal rape, and I will not apologize for what I said or feel about it.

You're surprised I didn't try to 'smear it with kiddy porn'? Jeez, I had no idea you thought so badly of me. Oh well.


From: Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist. | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
Andy (Andrew)
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posted 19 February 2006 03:57 PM      Profile for Andy (Andrew)   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Stargazer how your post came across was you were suggesting that the husband referenced in the thread was doing that. I thought that was a great leap to conclude it was anything other than "regular" porn. Your second post clarified that but your first post was not as clear, imho.

Jeffhouse she really confused hotmail for a porn site? She has bigger problems than jealousy and being snoopy.


From: Alberta | Registered: Nov 2005  |  IP: Logged
Mr. Magoo
guilty-pleasure
Babbler # 3469

posted 19 February 2006 05:23 PM      Profile for Mr. Magoo   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Or notice that your browser has been hijacked from all the porn viewing.

Just in case any babblers are heading down to their divorce lawyer right now: if you suspect — or even if you know — that your browser is hijacked, this does NOT mean that someone has been surfing for porn. You can get hijacked in all sorts of places.

Also, has there ever been a thread on babble concerning porn that did not quickly slide down the slippery slope into violent child porn? I bet you could start a thread on the Sports Illustrated Swimsuit Edition, and within 50 posts we'd be talking about snuff films.


From: ø¤°`°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°°¤ø, | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged
skdadl
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posted 19 February 2006 05:26 PM      Profile for skdadl     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Mr Magoo, did you really have to slide down the slippery slope that quickly, all the way to snuff films?

Really.


From: gone | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Michelle
Moderator
Babbler # 560

posted 19 February 2006 05:59 PM      Profile for Michelle   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Obviously there was a misunderstanding here. Chill out, RB, Stargazer didn't deserve that. It is quite possible that in a thread that is over 80 posts long, someone might not have read every single post before weighing in. I read her post the same way you did, but there's a such thing as giving someone the benefit of the doubt, y'know?
From: I've got a fever, and the only prescription is more cowbell. | Registered: May 2001  |  IP: Logged
Stargazer
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posted 19 February 2006 06:05 PM      Profile for Stargazer     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Magoo, aren't you the guy who used the logic that you have no viruses and you can tell because you have no virus scanner?

I'm sorry but it's not so easy for your browser to be hijacked with porn unless you are surfing for freeware off one of the many warez sites that link to porn or you are surfing for porn. I know. This is what I do every day at my job. Oh and of course clicking on the porn spam links, that'll do it too.

Andy, you're right I should have clarified my first post. I see no issue with the tame porn at all, and in fact have a fairly decent attitude about it, i.e. I could care less if my date watched porn. I suspect the majority of men do watch porn. I don't suspect the majority are downloading brutal rape porn.

I should have been clearer. I think that's the first time RB swore at me. I'll have to mark this date in my calendar. For the record, I am not peeved at RB.

[ 19 February 2006: Message edited by: Stargazer ]


From: Inside every cynical person, there is a disappointed idealist. | Registered: Jun 2004  |  IP: Logged
Mr. Magoo
guilty-pleasure
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posted 19 February 2006 06:35 PM      Profile for Mr. Magoo   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
I'm sorry but it's not so easy for your browser to be hijacked with porn unless you are surfing for freeware off one of the many warez sites that link to porn

So then you agree with:

quote:
this does NOT mean that someone has been surfing for porn. You can get hijacked in all sorts of places.

From: ø¤°`°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°°¤ø, | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged
fast_twitch_neurons
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posted 19 February 2006 07:25 PM      Profile for fast_twitch_neurons     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
White Rabbit, I'd like to suggest you try and do a better job judging men's characters. Perhaps get some male platonic friends, perhaps even they should be very different types of people, perhaps even try and date them. Among my friends I know quite a few womanizers, and quite a few gentlemen. The idea you espoused that the attitude you've found among the men you've dated (what a statistician would refer to as a 'biased sample') to be uniform among all men is preposterous.

[ 19 February 2006: Message edited by: fast_twitch_neurons ]


From: Montreal | Registered: Sep 2005  |  IP: Logged
Bacchus
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posted 20 February 2006 12:15 AM      Profile for Bacchus     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
I'm sorry but it's not so easy for your browser to be hijacked with porn unless you are surfing for freeware off one of the many warez sites that link to porn or you are surfing for porn. I know. This is what I do every day at my job. Oh and of course clicking on the porn spam links, that'll do it too.


Um I get to do this all day long and attending eye-popping seminars all over about hijacking, etc.

You pretty much just have to be on the net, to get hijacked, its that simple these days unless you really know your shit and can prevent all javascript, cookies, beacons etc from getting activated. Try using Search & Destroy or Adaware and I guarantee everytime you use it, they will find something on your computer. Even legit software that you buy, will load hidden stuff on your computer and lets not get into what gmail and google are doing these days


From: n/a | Registered: Dec 2003  |  IP: Logged
Doug
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Babbler # 44

posted 20 February 2006 12:29 AM      Profile for Doug   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by The Evil Twin:

"Womanizer"? Sounds like a term out of the 50s!


I find it an odd term too. Sounds like it should apply to a doctor who does M to F sex change surgery.


From: Toronto, Canada | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged
Lard Tunderin' Jeezus
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posted 20 February 2006 12:40 AM      Profile for Lard Tunderin' Jeezus   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
Originally posted by Doug:
I find it an odd term too. Sounds like it should apply to a doctor who does M to F sex change surgery.

Perfect!
The Womanizer:

[ 20 February 2006: Message edited by: Lard Tunderin' Jeezus ]


From: ... | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
Wilf Day
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Babbler # 3276

posted 20 February 2006 12:42 AM      Profile for Wilf Day     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Ask this "Don't Date Him, Girl!" site to search "Ontario" and you find a poor speller who has denounced four men in "Petersborough" -- I mean, what are the odds on four different women making the same spelling mistake -- for cheating on her. Hmm. How did she get to find four cheaters? While being faithful to which one of them? Oh, well.

But then there's quite an epidemic in our area. Two denounced in Port Perry, one in "Kendall" -- hmm, there's that speller again, perhaps -- and three in Oshawa.

I have no answer to this phenomenon. I'm not even sure I want to know the question.

[ 20 February 2006: Message edited by: Wilf Day ]


From: Port Hope, Ontario | Registered: Oct 2002  |  IP: Logged
Mr. Magoo
guilty-pleasure
Babbler # 3469

posted 20 February 2006 10:30 AM      Profile for Mr. Magoo   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
I guess it's only a matter of time before we see shewontputoutdude.com or shesgotalotofemotionalbaggage.com or some similar.

Anonymous revenge is the sweetest revenge.


From: ø¤°`°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°°¤ø,¸_¸,ø¤°°¤ø, | Registered: Dec 2002  |  IP: Logged
deBeauxOs
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posted 20 February 2006 12:17 PM      Profile for deBeauxOs     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
quote:
posted by Mr. Magoo: I guess it's only a matter of time before we see shewontputoutdude.com or shesgotalotofemotionalbaggage.com or some similar.
Anonymous revenge is the sweetest revenge.
Unlikely, since many guys are already doing the vengeance thang on an individual basis. More control over the manner of exposure - photoshopped pix of the ex in compromising or pornographic situations, even intimate photos taken when the relationship was good. Also the accompanying text can be more graphic, vile and violent.

Besides, the group or collective clustering for mutual support isn't really a guy thing, is it?


From: missing in action | Registered: Aug 2005  |  IP: Logged
audra trower williams
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posted 20 February 2006 01:50 PM      Profile for audra trower williams   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post
Too long!
From: And I'm a look you in the eye for every bar of the chorus | Registered: Apr 2001  |  IP: Logged

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